fire is normally not to be used until you know what you're doing because it as I was mentioning the moment you enter the commission ground or the date is then the rules also will change because they have their own ways of things Etc but anyway by the blessings of the mother it went up wonderfully well fantastic it went the nivedas were perfect the signs that you will get there's a whole signs of these signs that come in and it's difficult to explain but as you go deeper you realize this gurus will tell you and things like that and after a few days of that Homa I received a mantra in my dream the deity okay like a beach month full like a full month full month how did you remember it Ah that's because the Dream came twice so that one day one day it was very Vivid kind of dream I woke up and I saw that and not just the month right was like there were some actions that were being performed some things were going on Etc


were being performed some things were going on Etc in the dream are you comfortable sharing um okay so there was there was one form of the mother one of the mahavidyas very very intensely powerful mahavidyas uh I saw her taking me to a pond and there were two pawns actually and she asked me in the dream that which one do you like the color of the water was different one was crystal clear and the other was bluish and he pointed to one of them I'll not say which one because uh those who know these things they will understand what I'm saying those who do not know these things they will have one understanding of what I'm saying so after that she kind of dips me in that water in the dream and then there's a mantra that is told and then it's told that you start doing that but after the dream happened it was very Vivid I woke up and I refused to do it because I know that that specific form of mahavidya's intense okay


that that specific form of mahavidya's intense okay and should not be done just like that without a proper guidance from somebody or things like that Etc so I I resisted I said no and then my my tendency in these things is not to act as the believer to be a skeptic if a dream comes okay let's hold on wait let's see if there's something meant to be done is then some action meant to perform nature is going to show you more signs one dream could be your own mind playing tricks with you all the time it happens we want to believe that we are very good so tomorrow I am dreaming of all the all the hundreds of deities that are coming I mean nothing so in order to be on the you know uh on the side of caution and also because I thought that uh I was pretty not sure that I is this the form I should worship not the form I knew the the intensity of the form is very strong so I did not do


the form is very strong so I did not do anything but the dream repeated itself again after few days and with more Vigor so that I remember exactly what was going on etc etc and then the inspiration came very strongly and started doing that of the poem with the Mantra with the Mantra and after doing a few months of that Mantra sadhana means basically uh you're doing Japan of the Mantra repetition of the Mantra in a proper manner proper means not just roaming around and doing you sit like in meditation you sit you have a Japan you keep doing your chant yeah with the beads with the rudraksha beads or whatever beads you have you count how many times okay you are counting it and doing the job so like that as I kept doing foreign that is when I had a one day I remember pretty late in the night I was meditating and I uh I saw a figure standing in front of me okay I could sense that it was not a it was not an ordinary person


it was not a it was not an ordinary person it was there's tremendous amount of pages they just means it's Brilliance hello glow glow is still a softer term I'm saying Brilliance this is there's one light that is a it's a glow that's you know nice soothing in the eyes and there's one that shines like the sun something like that okay like that and um there was some instructions told to me that read certain books of is one of the greatest spiritual Mystics who lived and there in pondicherry okay yes uh I picked up I had earlier before this one two years ago I Tried reading Sierra window it did not make sense to me because I found this language too complicated for my understanding it's like one meter above the head it flows at that time and this time you read it it slipped into your eyes everything just this is and not just that I opened that specific book that page and there were certain things he was talking about this is


were certain things he was talking about this is precisely the confusions I was having at the time in my mind that's how the right spiritual books work yes exactly the knowledge will enter your head when you need it exactly and uh then it's after some time I I some more experiences happen but that I will not I'm not comfortable sharing but eventually what I realized is that an experience of Krishna started happening actually after that which was very strange and I wondered why is Krishna coming from anywhere at all because I am not even worshiping Krishna I am something else I am doing and then I started picked up a book of srior Windows biography and I realized that he he was a he had attained perfection in Krishna prasanna he was Krishna was the primary deity he is the one who's and the bhagavad-gita and Lord Krishna the ones who whom he worshiped most intensely in his own way so he did not do the normal vaishnava


way so he did not do the normal vaishnava upasana of Krishna what he did was more of meditative connection with Krishna to the extent that he had sort of become like Lord an emanation of Krishna that time he had their energy fully in him and the question started that there are many forms of Krishna so there is one form of Krishna that is to mention there's one form of Krishna who is who is the who's popular in the bhagavatam which is one of the spiritual texts who is the uh is the Delight of the gopis okay he's very sweet he's he is beautiful if you worship that you feel like in Bliss if that energy of Krishna little bit comes in but there is also the Krishna who gives you the bhagavad-gita who's standing in the battlefield okay and there is a confused Arjuna who's saying that no no I can't fight and then there is a conversation that goes on so that Krishna he is the teacher


goes on so that Krishna he is the teacher that aspect of Krishna is one who will pass make you pass through uh you have seen how clothes are dried by ringing them he will do exactly that throughout all impurities so that afterwards you have nothing left but to become spiritual and then he will give you the Gita and then you will never forget including people including everything that is what is that is what his style is yeah that is exactly what his style is okay and and Saints who have worshiped Krishna properly they all know this whether there is as I said there are two types of worship one is that the general bhakti you can do this all all doing and then you have that intensity of longing no I want that devatha in the manner like a friend like a father like a mother or whatever form you want to personalize that equation so that there is a two-way communication with the deity that is the highest stage of sadhana that is where you have to


stage of sadhana that is where you have to go Okay so Krishna is like that he's beautiful so if somebody tells me I find it very interesting just my personal opinion that somebody says that Krishna is the sweetest of course he's the sweetest but if you go closer to him he is going to make sure that everything that is non-spiritual in you every element in your body in your and means your environment slowly slowly pick out everything one after the other take take and that is going to be painful also what exactly what is he doing to Arjuna Arjuna comes and says that I can't fight okay these are my friends and relatives only how can I kill them Etc and if you see his conversational tone he starts up in the I think the second chapter when he starts off he's he's uh he starts off this with it uh it's like Loosely paraphrased into English that you speak like a pandita you speak like a wise man but actually these were these


speak like a wise man but actually these were these are not the words of wise men these are actually words of like somebody who's a fool somebody who's doesn't know and then he goes on slowly one after the other he starts explaining to him what is the spiritual reality of the world he even tells that there is a chance of in in I think fourth or fifth chapter he tells Moksha how do you attain Moksha you can stop this whole rebirth thing okay but it doesn't stop there so after Karma Yoga Gyan yoga one of the different yogas and all that he goes in and then finally he goes into yoga that is the 10th chapter where he says that what is his manifestations and there it's such a brilliant text he says that among the pandavas is Arjuna among the vishnis is Krishna so it is he's speaking of himself in third person you can ask that who is it that is speaking is it Krishna or is


it that is speaking is it Krishna or is it somebody else speaking through Krishna okay and then the next chapter he shows the vishwarupa was deep the transcendental form and every deity has this by the way and at that moment the only thing that Arjuna can do is bow down in reference when you see that kind of form of a deity all your mental conceptions are washed away only thing that will work is bhakti you'll just fall down in reverence either you will get scared and run away that also happens there are people or you just fall down in in irreverence okay and he tells him that I can't take this form you come back into your forearmed form that we know so popularly Etc and after that comes bhakti bhakti cannot be inculcated once you have that experience then bhakti will automatically develop that so this is this is how Krishna is um I have to we firstly I'm a little overwhelmed but I have to bring you back


little overwhelmed but I have to bring you back to that story so you said Krishna came into your life yes I'm assuming it's to remove maybe the microscopic non-spiritual elements that were remaining in your life or to put you through some process to like I don't know churn your emotions what happened then uh that was a period of excellent Spiritual Development for myself but at the same time mind you uh I used to I got a during that time uh once I had I had couple of more experiences of Krishna at that time automatically it started once I was uh developed a strong reverence for Sri orobindo okay because uh SRI aurobindo is like my is the portal for me for Krishna from him I went to Krishna otherwise I did not have any information for Krishna so only uh after reading him and developing a strong understanding so I used to like that one specific sentence to write about Krishna somewhere uh written that if you know only Krishna then you


written that if you know only Krishna then you know nothing about Krishna he's so vast that he can Encompass everything okay he's absolutely Universal in one sense and he's also very personal he holds both of these aspects in him but at the same time while I was doing a certain amount of krishna-basana I got some books on Krishna uh books means bhagavatam the 10th chapter of the bhagavatam srimad-bhagavadam contains the life of Krishna that is the most beautiful text if somebody studies it actually people do person of it seven days they will study you know confine yourself I used to tell people confide yourself to a room for seven or ten days don't meet anybody unnecessarily eat completely uh as satwik food as you can okay as light food not just vegetarian I am saying that as light food I mean if your stomach goes full up to this Mark then eat three-fourths of it not more than that okay keep a little empty spend reading the


than that okay keep a little empty spend reading the bhagavatam spent contemplating on the bhagavatam imagining how Krishna from childhood what is he doing every story there is something on the other that is going on okay if you if you go deeper into the explanations and it's beautiful uh seven ten days you do that properly and don't meet people don't and no unnecessary phone calls cut off your internet and all that things that is the the biggest rahu roaming around in the world okay that's breaking of concentration is the easiest thing to do from the internet but keep all that aside just do that you'll have a blissful experience that text has a power it has a Shakti in it uh so bhagavadam was reading the bhagavatam was very good and uh meanwhile at the same time my primary ubasana was still going on okay it did not it doesn't stop for the Mata the my main devatha basanas will always happen wherever I may be even say today also


happen wherever I may be even say today also uh I've whenever I'm going somewhere I have to first plan it this way that okay if I reach here uh this amount of time I'll have to do need to complete my uh it's like a sewer to the gods service to the gods okay I don't look at it as something like oh I have to again complete second it's not like a task that has to be completed it is something you do willfully out of Joy then only will enjoy then only you can sustain till the end otherwise the moment you feel that oh just a task you have to complete 100 after some days it'll fall off and then you will also fall off from the path that's how it goes only those who can enjoy doing it you look at it as a save out to the gods okay and they will also interact with you eventually so anyway that uh that sadhna was going on uh the Krishna phase went on for few months and I read a lot


went on for few months and I read a lot of Sri aurobindo it helped me clarify many Concepts about spirituality and even though my path is primarily I am a I like Tantra basana that's what I do but I found no conflict in the ways explained various things and how those applies to the traditional tantric path okay he's a brilliant thinker I mean one of the best in my opinion uh that I've read and I remain eternally devoted to him for the excellent writing he has done but yes his his writing is little complicated so it takes time to get in once you understand the Rhythm and then you'll why have you highlighted this whole experience though like what was special about this whole phase uh because that time first of all uh this came to mind because we were talking about Krishna so that's why this episode came to mind that I had an experience for you so that was important in the sense that two things were going on one was the Krishna


two things were going on one was the Krishna upasana Krishna and srior window wasn't in fact once I remember uh I was coming in a local train uh coming to office and I just finished reading the bhagavatam in the morning and suddenly you know how Mumbai locals are like full Market going on Etc so I get down from the train and there's this uh I don't know what two groups were fighting among themselves or something I just by my mind was in a different state at that time so I was going to office but I was not fully aware that what is happening okay around me Etc and um I just somehow stepped into that fighting Zone and both the size didn't know who I was with so both of us started beating me okay no the funny part is and just like that okay it was everybody is meeting everybody and then that's the few blows came in and then my mind was back into the normal oh where am I okay what exactly it is


normal oh where am I okay what exactly it is and this happened outside of the vikroli station remember because I have to get down there from my office sometimes and right after that suddenly they realized that who's this guy okay so they left me and they kept doing whatever they were doing right after that this guy comes another guy some random guy comes in he opens a packet of sweets and says so this is uh this is Prasad from Krishna Lord Krishna okay and he puts one into my mouth okay just like that this was the I mean if you look at it rationally it makes no sense but for me because I had just come I was in that kind of a state so you have to immerse yourself into the devada you're worshiping and that time my mind was completely into Krishna completely into okay what is the the stories of the bhagavatam every description various other things and whatever else was going on Etc so that when you say this from Krishna that was


that when you say this from Krishna that was like a shock it's like a tongue and then I felt very funny because this is precisely how he works actually when he decides to take somebody to the highest levels so he will kind of cut out all the weed around you and things like that what he thinks it's he's not going to give you what you want by the way but that is impossible that you sort of give up that if he gives you that then you are perhaps at the very lower stage of the person after that because human beings have this tendency that we love to hang on to our flaws otherwise we would have self-progressed without the need of any day with them we love to hang on to our flaws so that is when he does the kurukshetra on you and after doing the kurukshetra then the Gita will come to you and then you will be in a must State cleanse cleansing that is what Krishna does so that phase many other things


what Krishna does so that phase many other things also started by the way I started going more frequently to kamakhya which is a place where I do a lot of personal in a way I have no poems in saying that she's the one who's helped me uh and not just help me how to personalize what I do so I went nine times to Karma in fact uh I used to spend a lot of time in kamakhya Temple which is a hardcore tantric Temple not even a Shakti Temple it's a tantric Temple there are many Devi temples in India but kamakhya is hard code the only reason I'm not gonna ask you questions about Karma cares because it's a whole other episode so but in I remember in kamakhya once one day in at 1 1 30 at night and those days the crowds were lesser now this it keeps increasing year after year and I was sitting and I was actually reading the Gita because that time my Krishna experiences


the Gita because that time my Krishna experiences were also happening so I in my mind there was never a conflict you can't do it this way you can't be happy this is a tantric Temple nothing of that sort if your mind is clear and if clear that is also important I'll come that's another aspect of it anyway so so I I was doing that also in that in that in karma came it was there many changes happened that time many changes within because of the Mantra sadness of the of the of the deity which triggered all this see how does this happen because there was a I took a sankalpa why the reason now that you mentioned so I took a sankalpa for a devatha upasana the deity took me to a particular Temple I did a Huma there then there was a mantra that comes in I keep chanting that Mantra that Mantra takes me to Krishna Krishna is not my history but I must have worshiped Krishna in some


but I must have worshiped Krishna in some lifetime if you have worshiped somebody in some lifetime as you progress they'll all come back once in a while okay it's not going to go away that easily so that experience was meant for me to happen and that clarified my views on various things that helped me understand because Krishna is also not just love he is the greatest gyani okay it is his Blessing that made sriorobindo what you it is my opinion that shirobindo became one of the greatest spiritual Minds that we have come across by virtue of the blessings of Lord Krishna okay he was like that so Krishna is not only about love that is there that aspect is there but he's also the one who gives the Gita so he is the jagat guru or the guru of the universe okay so he can clarify things and very strangely just as another tangent that comes in as I keep speaking these things that's the nature sadhana


keep speaking these things that's the nature sadhana texts will tell you there's a very interesting line I was reading couple of months ago there's I think it's from the bridge which is about matara and they say is that in it says in the Kali yoga it's all about the Devi worship and various things Etc and lordship obviously comes in wherever there is a goddess there because he's there but it says in Kali yoga that deity who has full control apart from the mahavidya devathas is also Krishna so Krishna is even considered as a projection of mahakali by the way yeah in Tantra is believed that Kali in one place is Kali one place is sundari is one form of uh Transit form of the mother Divine mother who has impossible capacity of some mohana which means their attraction okay and various spiritual qualities Etc so once they decided once she decided to Incarnate in a male form and in Bengal there are traditions where Krishna


and in Bengal there are traditions where Krishna and Kali are worship together it's called Krishna Kali didn't know this yeah one of the greatest tantric uh [Music] who's most traveled in 15th century used to live his name was krishnananda so he was a Kali upasar whereas his brother he was born into a family I think that has vaishnava leanings so his brother was a Krishna pasaka and they say that one night they had a just a debate and a discussion then who is greater Kali is greater or Krishna is greater and throughout the night they say okay I'll show you that what is the power of my ishta devatha he said what is the power of mahishta Devi Etc and they said well that's the uh sort of the legend the story that comes in to us and more than 24 hours they sat and did Japan of their deities Etc and then simultaneously they had a vision of Krishna and Kali it's like they're


vision of Krishna and Kali it's like they're non-different okay penny is male is Krishna the moment he turns into female becomes Kali okay it's one person and now I'm not saying all vaishnavas have to start looking at uh you know should not be misinterpreted in that sense but yes there is a traditional way of upasana like this and you would be amazed that for example since mataras vigora is here one of the greatest means one who lives in The Cremation ground countries there was a great great ultimate to the power ultimate one of his gurus main gurus was known ASI why because his name was not known he had come from Raj which is vrindavan it come from vrindavan to tarapit which is The Cremation ground to give initiation and training to wama Kappa when he was young and he used to wear a Tulsi Mala is something and you sustain The Cremation ground and vamachapa used to say that all his disciples were all the spirits in


that all his disciples were all the spirits in the creation ground whenever I used to enter The Cremation ground the spiritual stand but these two interesting thing is he used to wear a vaishnavamala he would not wear a rudraksha he'd not think so he was a person who was doing some Krishna person or somewhere and he was a extraordinary genius nothing more is known about him because one day when one day just vanished and nothing after that nobody got to know where he came from what is his real name Etc they called him rajavasi because in those olden times he ever suppose you are from one particular place they'll just add the name of the place to that person so it's easier to recognize okay means he's come from Raj Raj is where Krishna yeah so it is diverse these are diverse Parts but somewhere links are also there those who are capable there's a hundred more podcasts to do with you uh I think you're one of those people where I as


I think you're one of those people where I as a podcast have to dig out the information but also as a podcaster I feel um I go on my own journey of evolution over the course of this podcast and it's so strange that we're meeting today you know like how you said at the start of this episode you know another interesting thing so Krishna Lord Krishna was born on ashramidity right so ashtamis are considered to be I mean um of course he is a vaishnu avatar no doubt he's an avatar of Vishnu but ashtamis are extremely popular for two deities one is ma Durga and one is at one point in his life by the way he had exceptional upasana of Shiva he had done not just ordinary he had come and taken Specific Instructions from one of the greatest Shiva rishis at that time and the upasana was so Fierce that there is description that he used to take a skull in his like the way or gharu pasanas actually happened


like the way or gharu pasanas actually happened like that used to spend time doing the upasana for months okay and not eating food and standing on one leg and then he had a vision of Shiva and Parvati and they blessed Him With Many various things undying Fame Etc innumerable things Okay so of course again I'm not saying the traditional people get spooked if I try to link these two but I am saying that there is it's uncanny and uh difficult not to notice that here is an avatar of Vishnu a man of such tremendous spiritual ability that after six Thousand Years also the whole culture is worshiping him no doubt but he's born on a tithi which is so specific and so important for the shaivas and shaktas Shiva shaktas is linked together okay they're not different happens on ashtamitis the position of the the angular position of the sun and the moon causes a tithi there are 15 uh uh so waning phase and the


there are 15 uh uh so waning phase and the waxing phase of the moon determine the teeth there are 30 tithis in a month 15 at the bright phase where the moon is going up to put him a full moon and then there is the new moon slowly coming down to New Moon so ashtami titis are specifically important for bhairava foreign and things like that because in which Gita was given to uh Arjuna okay but uh ashtami that I was speaking of is very popular for bhairava upasana and also for Madura bhagavati okay and Ashton is a difficulty difficult means it's a theory of transformation there's no difference between Shiva only difference is that whenever is a fierce manifestation of Shiva yeah and being Shiva with somehara karaka was The Lord Of Destruction distraction what is distraction any change is destruction okay and change is happening all the time whenever you have the concept of time in your mind there is a change that is happening so there is some


a change that is happening so there is some death going on all the time little bit little bit for good because if you don't change then you'll never progress in the first place death of thoughts debt of thoughts everything yeah not just death that is the dramatic death we understand that's one aspect but even the smallest changes when you were a kid you had a certain liking for this clothes this TV show that TV show Changes Everything changes that is death death of thoughts death of Personality death of everything that is happening he governs this whole phenomenon of change Shiva is the God of destruction actually means this exactly he is the one who causes change both at the minute level for you as well as the cosmic level when the universe has to change okay um again we've released electricity on this episode and listeners of the podcast at this point know how powerful this particular episode is I almost feel like I had to earn this conversation with you and lately I've been thinking so


conversation with you and lately I've been thinking so much of Kalima of just a lot of Kalima and a lot of Tara it's so strange of having this conversation today so like including like like my meditation right I meditate every morning yeah I could only get like Kalima today I don't know why I didn't know that you know you have this whole past with Tara And Kali but again I feel like I had to own this episode side note so I feel like you know I question material growth a lot in life like I love it but I question it owns what is its true purpose is it just for charity you know is it to make you experience all the material Pleasures so that you're done with it and then you go towards spiritual Pleasures I don't know because I can feel that change in me very strongly the material the lust for material Pleasures is completely going away um and the lust for growth in the form that you know it is increasing I don't want to call


know it is increasing I don't want to call it lust but you know what I mean like I'm more in line towards it I'm building a meditation app and it's been two years and we've bootstrapped it so it's been a very difficult Journey okay but I've been guided I mean believe it or not I think the listeners by this point are believers I feel like I've been guided in dreams about the the app okay um and there's some powerful healing that we've backed in and again the strange thing there is um I have two co-founders one's a devout Krishna one's a devout Mata and I'm like caught in the middle I love both the guys so uh yeah I don't I don't know what's happening there uh but I do feel that the app is not just made by the three of us it's being it's being created uh maybe as my last kind of material Adventure in life after which this will happen but do you believe in these possibilities so that


but do you believe in these possibilities so that uh you know God makes you go through these material experiences to kind of just get get it done if there is a somewhere first of all I don't believe that uh you have to completely shun material life to become spiritual some parts require that but it's not fundamentally important what is important is eventually develop a kind of Detachment even within the material sphere so enjoy all the things that nature automatically gives you if nature is giving you something nature is giving a platform which is giving you money and which is giving you whatever is coming take it but don't be too attached to it the whole point of the practice is to be that your focus is so high on the devatha that tomorrow is the day so as a devotee of the god of the deity whom I worship so I consider every growth every positive is her doing every negative is also heard doing yeah yeah at the end of the day she will lead me to where I


of the day she will lead me to where I exactly need to be but I just have to trust Now problem comes once when things are good everybody is happy we're all fine when things go bad that is when you start having whether it's doubt or whether it's pain it's human to have all these emotions Etc the whole point of the practice is your Devotion to that Divine being whomever you worship we beat um Krishna or anybody is so strong that you have that Detachment within you to say that uh okay it came from her or it came from him it went away it's fine I'm you cannot go into a sort of key it has gone off let's go into depression now then you're screwed your job is to maintain even in the midst of spirituality even in the midst of material growth Etc to maintain certain degree of Detachment from it and practices for example meditation or any other practice done regularly helps you get that perspective right the whole point of devada


get that perspective right the whole point of devada is a vast by the way all the deities that we worship they're extremely vast their vast means they were there even before the first human being appeared in evolution okay and tomorrow if by some unfortunate luck the Earth ceases to exist the deities will go on they are not going to go anywhere their perspective is tremendous thousands and thousands of years they see that's why when they see that's why they're so difficult also to get to them it's one thing to worship bhakti uh a little bit all that is fine but I am talking about the highest worship which in the texts we call it siddhi siddhi is a term that is misunderstood by some but siddhi in its true sense means full accomplishment of the path it means where as I said you reach a stage where you and your start completely bonded okay that is the ultimate siddhi okay now they look at you but that is difficult why that's because


at you but that is difficult why that's because their perspective is very difficult they're they're very large they are they can see for Aeons and eons of time and you are too small your lifetime 60 or 70 is whatever or 80 years whatever a person lives just a blink of an eye not even that passes just like that for them so why will they leave all that and come to you so easily you have to you have to display a commitment a devotion a willpower that transcends your puny life yeah um you know for the last question or last phase of this particular episode so I gotta bring you back to the levels of Tantra you spoke about you don't have to expand too much on it okay just give the listeners an idea right from the start okay uh in terms of you know where does it begin and you said there are seven um do you think that this requires another episode to really expand upon there are hundreds of things I can give you a brief gist of sure and then


can give you a brief gist of sure and then let's do another episode at some point about it but let's hear the brief so look at acharam as a stage of progress sort of so the stage of progress comes that first you start with vedachara where you do the upasana in the normal way it is to be done okay and they will tell you that you cannot you should ideally do it in the daytime and follow the average restrictions of upasana any date you worship doesn't matter after that you go to the vaishnavatara which is that acharam which is basically uh you have a more singular Focus so in vedachara is basically when there is ganpati Festival you worship ganpati when there is navratri you do navratri even shivratri so you do all the devatha Puja little little and you are starting to develop in a Consciousness and then you become more focused basically you put on the you you are dedicated upasaka of some of the other form of vish2 and


of some of the other form of vish2 and the niyamas the rules that come into that worship also employ get employed deployed in this stage you can only learn all these rules and regulations through a guru a little bit through a guru but if you are in the tantric path specifically if Tantra is what you really need to yes you will have that is where after this I'll explain after this there's this are considered as somebody uh you know you study texts more you you not only practice but you also read the scriptures relevant to the um of the path that you are in okay what does the accumulated wisdom for thousands of years say what does it mean okay what is the interpretation of it what is the tattoo which is the philosophy that I'm trying to uh you know inculcate in my mind and through this practice and all that then comes dakshinachara this is where Tantra properly starts Dakshin means right achara means Behavior okay the practice or a mode of behavior


means Behavior okay the practice or a mode of behavior here you will need an initiation so tantras are clear that in this stage once you start doing Shakti mantra's worship of Shakti is the mother goddess you will have to have one initiation from a guru proper initiation okay and there are term there's specifications of this initiation that is to be given the whole point of initiation is that Shakti mantras work very fast so initiation if you're if you're worshiping Shiva mantras if you are worshiping Krishna mantras then abhisheka diksha is not mandatory you may have an upadhisha means just a verbal advice from somebody can you can carry on but if you have to go into Shakti mantras that inverse Vijaya mantras and all that they work with tremendous speed okay and they cause changes very fast individual and naturally nobody is is able to self-regulate them you will need somebody higher somebody more experienced to guide you through those phases and so the


to guide you through those phases and so the abhisheka diksha comes in the guru and Guru means not just one individual is the guru parampara guru as a guru guru as a guru so this is a line of gurus even Lord Krishna had a guru the only being in the universe who doesn't have a guru is Shiva is who was Lord krishna's Guru oh Lord Krishna had Veda gurus for he had learned The Vedas from then he had gone to an ashram in ujjain various other places so this text will mention that he also had to learn these things he mastered them that's a different matter but he had to learn the 64 kalas Vedas and this and that all the rishis were there to teach him Etc so in the universe there was only one being there is no guru and that is Shiva okay he's the is the ADI Deva sort of uh but this should not be misconstrued as uh saying that a is bigger


misconstrued as uh saying that a is bigger or smaller human mind tries to do that absolutely not both of them are Divine entities it's another concept will not go into that okay so uh after this you start your practice then there will be means you have to place uh mantras in your body different places Ah that's a practice what what does that mean write it no you chant certain mantras and you touch certain parts of the body and you keep doing that over time months and years not even months years and years to Resonance your body becomes purified by those mantras and the deity will approach you faster this is like a spiritual tattoo absolutely and these that is this from this stage on secrecy becomes important you cannot do these practices in front of somebody who's not meant to see that uh after this stage dakshinachara only difference is dakshinachara is that you follow uh so you you uh you use standard religious ingredients so you give a bognition offering of food


ingredients so you give a bognition offering of food to the deity that you have to offer so normally what whatever we offer you know uh rice or whatever vegetarian ingredients Etc you worship at specific times of the day daytime you worship and uh various other niyamas are there so it is also fully following the right hand path right hand path means which is the sword of parallel to the Vedic path so whatever in Vedic path is not to be done we also don't do it this path okay so you keep doing and it's very powerful lot of people have this misconception it's simple not at all I've met gurus who are fascinatingly all dakshina is one of my gurus is tremendous I mean it's fantastic out of the world Okay so as I said the thing is practice practice practice it will work start working it will have experiences also then comes what is known as vamachara vamachara is the left hand path vamachara also requires a diksha okay after this after you


also requires a diksha okay after this after you have integrated dakshinachara upasana to the full then you start using the most infamous things in Tantra for which Tantra both has the Curiosity and those who do not know they put you know blame on Tantra and things like that which is the Pancho Makara has to be used to the deity offered to the lady is five representative tatas which are meat has to be used okay then mudra mudra specific grains Etc fish then alcohol and last is my tuna sex but it is not like that key tomorrow I just get one chicken Tandoori and give no it doesn't work that way okay there are various rules of this various rules each of these have to be uh you have to do Mantra pasana on these ingredients to purify them okay and then on the offer and then it's highly Technical and it's beautiful if you do it this way and you have to know which date you have to you are giving it


know which date you have to you are giving it to so you cannot do Shiva upasana this way by the way if you have the initiation if the guru has given you the permission then you can do all this and it is a lightning speed path I mean uh those who have a negative connotation of Tantra based on these are generally people who are Outsiders of the field that's my perception and if it's a lightning speed bar that can backfire yes that is why there are so many stages you are not to enter into it in day one in fact Shiva Lord Shiva says he says that this is this the vamachara or also known as the kolachara see says that the kolachara is the greatest of the acharas okay but if an unfit individual enters into it not only the Shakti will leave him but he will fall into a state worse than he had started and I've seen so many cases like that people fail because of arrogance as well arrogance again Arab


because of arrogance as well arrogance again Arab no Arabic failure due to arrogance is common to all parts I have any path even dakshinachar also will give you a lot of power it's not that vamachara gives you specific power but certain deities upasana works very well if it is done in the vamacharya means a method of worship so the failure happens mainly in technicalities and the fitness of it whether are you fit for that not everybody see the reason first of all we have so many paths so many ideas because different people has different have different tendencies so somebody is not fit for this upasana but he sees something and he feels that something esoteric is happening I just have to enter into it he's going to not doesn't have the self-control for that he will he'll fall it's not meant to have uh it's not meant for somebody who's not prepared so I if there's no gatekeeping here I'm not saying that you cannot do I am


I'm not saying that you cannot do I am saying that you can do if you prepare yourself and that preparation is not about one day's time but we're talking about lightning speed again so um the end goal is nirvana moksh here there is another very interesting a huge topic this is end goal so end goal Nirvana is there okay but there are other texts which tell you that uh there's something called sum of Asia which is the deity entering into you suppose you're worshiping Lord Krishna and tomorrow you reach a stage I'm just saying because say you're a Christian devotee you reach a stage where uh Krishna enters into your body and stays inside your body all the time so are you are you ranveer or are you Krishna that is the ultimate state of the upasana also we are trying to reach Moksha and all that is there that's possible but we reach a state where the as I was saying the deity has to be one with you to that extent


deity has to be one with you to that extent that you are not you anymore and there's a beautiful statement that comes in the kamakatha where uh Parvati bhairavi actually speaking they give the tantras in the conversational format he's asking that uh what about the shutter darshan six philosophies of Hindu Dharma which is the main fundamental vedanta yoga this that six of them are there so uh what do you think of that which is the best one and Shiva is saying that I created the sixth philosophies so that they can keep arguing among themselves you keep doing sadhana you reach the state which is beyond the mind and then you see for yourself what is the reality what is there okay so not to denigrate the darshanas they are also beautiful in their own domain and wonderful thing but you have until you cannot become a you cannot because by reading books by hearing from somebody you have to sit and you have to do you have to sit and you have


have to do you have to sit and you have to do like this for an absolute Noob where do you begin is there a book interest you have to have a genuine interest if you have a genuine interest and you seriously want to worship uh the tantric devatas tantric devatas means those devadas have to be approached finally in the tantric path so what you can do is that suppose somebody is a upasaka of Kali okay there are two ways in which you can approach markali one is the the proper the formal ways where you take an initiation you learn how to do the uh worship and all that and the other is that say there is a fitness for Kali upasana and you You Can chant the names of Curry 108 special names nobody needs any permission to chant those you don't need a guru's advice also but ha you have to see whether the fitness is there what I mean by that is somebody is extremely soft natured very soft natured individual you give him


soft natured very soft natured individual you give him the ashtottara Nama of mahavidya like which is extremely fierce in 10 days only you'll get scared the experiences that will start so that Fitness judgment has to be basically there that am I fit um is that there that strength inside you in your heart to worship that deity yeah that's common sense yes I'm not even saying anything complicated if that is there if you are say you want to learn Tantra basana first of all don't be in a hurry trust nature okay if you if you hurry you will fall that's absolutely guaranteed so if you are a devotee of mahakali or matara even so pick out any simple stotra or simple which is the 108 names of the deity and these days because of the age of the internet everything is available you just have to do a Google that's all and with devotion without being creative without being creative means I know people you know little bit of Tantra here and there they read and


little bit of Tantra here and there they read and they start tomorrow they'll bring one bottle of alcohol and start no absolutely not simple way you worship which means that you give a normal vegetarian with them to the goddess them in something or food offering some little bit of water you sit down put one another and you start chanting the hundred names keep doing that don't be in a hurry six months six years 60 years if she wants it in one day you will progress she'll send the right person right connection right base right situation right situation right podcast yes uh no I I strongly believe that you don't make money out of these things yes um I feel that I would like to believe that this is sort of the beginning of the age of light as I was told by BK Shivani on the show okay the world is changing we're seeing it all around us and that's why we're seeing this Resurgence of spiritualism that's why podcasts like this are taking off so much


why podcasts like this are taking off so much yes and I want to thank you for giving us one of the episodes of the year or so I don't know what we're doing but I know that neither you know me decided to make this a possibility yes so um again first of many conversations I am just accepting this information into my life so yeah bow down to you uh thank you for all the knowledge and lots more to ask you oh thank you yeah how are you feeling now I'm recording this the day after we hosted rajashi so on the show for the first time and I'm still feeling dizzy with all the information we did a total of five podcasts with him which will be released very gradually um honestly because I want people to go back to this first episode and listen to it again truly understand it again all I can say about the next four episodes is that one was in Hindi three were in English and they all more intense than the previous one um too many


all more intense than the previous one um too many experiences shared too much knowledge shared and the bioces team have to create a lot more podcasts together it's left me with so many thoughts and I just want to share that feeling that emotion with you all I'd also like to share the meditation app we've built over the last couple of years linked it down below that's all I'm gonna say download it you'll earn yourself a free trial if you download it from this link use it if you enjoy it join us on the level super mind community and journey we're changing the world together and I hope that you enjoyed today's episode for more episodes like this make sure you follow us on Spotify every episode's available on Spotify 48 hours before it's available anywhere else in the world lots of deep content coming your way on the ranveer thank you [Music]


I saw Rebels with amputated arms carrying a AK with just one arm and with his one hand he's taking out his amputed hand and gesturing doctor put it back and he had gangrene smelling blood red eyes on drugs the day we had to go on the first flight to South Sudan from the same flight I was the nominated nominated officer from my paltan to receive mortal remains of Lieutenant Colony mahipal he was from mechanized infantry who were ambushed in bore cargo terminals say I was getting the paperwork done receiving the Mortal domains and side by side I was seeing my troops lined up going to board the same aircraft and I knew that where we are going to go right now is not what everyone has been perceiving it to be so we've done a bunch of military podcasts with special forces veterans but the Infantry is one of the most and I'm using this word positively but one of the most chaotic specs of the army life in the


most chaotic specs of the army life in the Infantry is all about chaos going into situations and figuring out what to do on the spot thinking about teamwork thinking about combat very actively it's a very chaotic lifestyle as major summer tours spoke about in today's episode the biggest Joy I get out of doing these podcasts is absorbing experiences from so many of my guests and there's a limited amount of experiences you can gain from someone who spent most of their time in urban environments but what about someone who spent so much of their time on the ciachen glacier what about someone who spent their time in Africa what about someone who spent their time primarily on the battlefield this is a conversation with a warrior another epic military podcast for more podcasts like this make sure you follow us on Spotify every episode's available on Spotify 48 hours before it's available anywhere else in the world because we're a Spotify exclusive major summer tour is on the runway show today sharing all his experiences and


the runway show today sharing all his experiences and all his perspectives foreign [Music] thank you for being here sir you have such a friendly face and I know that there is such a dominating badass energy behind that face so I very very Punjabi energy I love it how's it going so how are you uh so far so good okay as usual okay that's how it goes you know life is like that and even if it is so far not good we better make it good what does an army career do to a person's mind uh it helps you uh acclimatize to your surroundings even in the most uncomfortable manner or a situation you are in I mean it makes you accept the situation in which you are you know so it it uh it readies you to face All Odds out of your comfort zone because as I always said you know uh life is intense that is why heartbeat pattern is like a frequency you know and if that frequency goes it becomes straight there's nothing to talk


frequency goes it becomes straight there's nothing to talk about yeah so that's how you know Army molds you as per the frequency of fluctuation in your life so mentally it's shaping you to take on All Odds whatever you're going to face Inland or abroad wherever you may be so yeah it keeps you ready I would not want to face a guy like you in battle I mean every officer that I met there is this one very thin layer of intimidation I feel maybe in the first micro second of meeting the person which goes away the moment you smile the moment you talk you know it fades away but in your Warrior Avatar I would not want to face an Indian army officer and I've met enough to know that they're all badasses like the Indian armies are very aggressive uh Force that's what I'll say and I I don't get how with the internet in the modern day with internet penetration how these terrorists are not understanding the ferocity of the Indian Armed Forces why


the ferocity of the Indian Armed Forces why would they consciously want to take on people like yourself we are trained to lay down our lives mentally and physically we've been trained we've been programmed in a much better and a refined manner where I am while in service I was and I still am mentally and physically ready to go into battle and I am ready to accept the consequences of my wife becoming a widow of my children becoming often I mean that is the kind of patriotism uh and that Zeal and that uh you know Pepe enthusiasm and Josh that we still have and that's not going to go it's like a a positive virus that has been imbibed into us that tomorrow you know if they say okay you guys are veterans but you need to go in there I'm not going to think twice I'm going to go in so if they think they are ferrigns we are even more worse than what they think we are it's just that you know we


they think we are it's just that you know we are controlled we are working in a uh organization where we have to protect democracy you know we got to protect civilization we go to create an atmosphere of comfort for our citizens you know we've got to protect them from the bad element and you know they say that in search of uh a hero there you know Devils exist but you know in terms of destroying the devil you need a bigger devil you know I mean in today's scenario it has come to that that to a teacher develop a lesser you've got to be a bigger devil you know yeah we are not here to be heroes we are here to tell them to lay off because it's already too late for their mindset to change so now it's time that we already give them a message that it's better to lay off because you've got to meet a dead end anyways yeah I want to ask you both about your first combat experience and the one that was the most intense or the one that


one that was the most intense or the one that stayed with you the longest I'll let you pick whichever one you want to talk about first uh I'll tell you first time when uh I handled uh the model remains I was at CI chin so you know it's fight against nature over there the environment is so harsh and you know I don't know my first posting you know so I felt like a physical stud and everything you know but that is one terrain which pushes you beyond your mental will you know why it's it's very difficult there is you have to fight for oxygen to breathe you got to fight to gather your energy after every 20 steps you get you got to carry your own battle load in that environment they are blizzards they are crevasses the temperature is in minus you've got to fight against frostbite you've got to fight against high altitude pulmonary edema if the condensation effect in a glass if you put cold water and you put it out in the warm environment so you


you put it out in the warm environment so you see the droplets so in the lungs water accumulates due to the variation of the body's temperature body temperature and the outside temperature and the air that we are taking in so you know you you've got to fight it out and these are things beyond your it's beyond human control can you describe siachen uh sort of from the first time you saw it in terms of what was in your mindset about how it would look how it would be versus what did it actually look like and what it actually feel like uh once I got to know uh where my unit was so I just boarded the aircraft I was wearing my normal combats my jacket and everything was in my bag so the moment I landed at a particular place there and the moment you know that gust of wind hit my face when I walked onto the stairway onto the tarmac that is where I realized I said this kind of chilled air I have not experienced yet and that is


air I have not experienced yet and that is where the troops along alongside me said yeah because I was I was that unprepared you know I I've never been to such a Terrain ever and that's the highest Battlefield on Earth how old were you I was probably 24. 23 24 24 years of age and what are the temperatures like it used to go up to minus 30. wow minus 30. minus 30 degrees Celsius yeah I've been in like minus five and it was like horrible cold there's no way my imagination even reaches that point why don't you describe what minus 30 degrees Celsius minus 30 used to be like you know where I feel helpless I start to laugh when things go beyond my control so at times I just sit there as you start laughing and this is so I used to be like yeah helplessness yes that's the best motivating factor that I could face you know in fact when we used to go even to the loop we used to time it that will not be in the


used to time it that will not be in the loop for more than 180 seconds really that's like three minutes so it used to be that bad if you go beyond that three minute Mark what happened I mean it affects your body you know that kind of temperature and that kind of altitude you know your your body organs and your uh metabolism because see you at such a height and there's no Oxygen so firstly you don't get sleep you need sufficient oxygen for your mind to be at ease and calm and to sleep so oxygen number two you need oxygen to digest your food again due to lack of oxygen you don't feel like eating food you know two potatoes I mean you've taken two stones and you've hit them together right potatoes and tomatoes used to be like that it used to take where in a normal condition it takes just half an hour for food to boil and get ready or at times the even overboil within half half an hour it used to take one hour for it


an hour it used to take one hour for it to just become normal in its thawing process so that was the ground reality that hit us you know and we had Russians there but we couldn't consume because you know it is humanly not possible to consume it maybe we didn't because you know we're fighting against nature what is the food that you're given there see we have tinned food preserved food like we have canned pineapples canned uh Chico's uh baked beans and then uh we have dry Russians thicker than we have for energy we have chocolates what is a dryer dry Russian is like you know uh dry uh dry kind of masalas and everything okay because they can't be in that semi-solid state then we have MREs meals ready to eat for the putting it in boiled water what does it taste like uh it tastes good but uh the technical aspect of it is you know it causes constipation obviously operationally you know when you carry all these things with you in your


when you carry all these things with you in your backpack so obviously I can't keep going to the loop so they manufactured in such a way you know technically and scientifically you know with the specifications that once I consume that particular MRE uh you know probably I need to go and clear my stomach probably or in 12 hours or maybe 18 hours then in a usual environment where I need to go after four or five hours or something so yes it does have a effect on your body mechanism and Metabolism I mean we are officers but at such at such Heights you know 20 000 plus feet above sea level and minus 20 minus 30 you know you are you can't be uh nagging your troops all the time you've got to make an environment comfortable to them you've got to keep acquainting them with the training you got to keep training them on the weapon systems you got to keep updating them about current affairs and all and probably like when my father was in CI chin during his times


when my father was in CI chin during his times there was no connectivity at all you know they used to just write letters Inland letters you know just to just write the blue ones you know you could fold them and just seal them and send it this is in the 80s yeah this is in the 80s I'm talking about my dad was in Seattle in 8687. roughly when it was recaptured 84 it was taken over and off make dude came into place on 13th of April 84 I believe so and my father was there in 86. I think it's important very briefly to just touch upon uh why it was even retaken uh there's a lot of gen Z listeners teenagers who are not familiar with the siachen story everyone knows what sea urchin is everyone knows how brutal it is not everyone knows the backstory so if you could just brief the listeners a little bit CI chin is a tactically situated it's a glacier basically at the reason why it was taken in haste was


at the reason why it was taken in haste was it is a tri-junction where it borders with Pakistan and China and that is the Tipping Point where the distance between Afghanistan and India is the least so what comes in between is the karakoram range so when I was supposed to say you know uh we used to hear the blasting taking place on the enemy side you know what do you mean what do you mean blasting is basically the the Chinese were helping them construct this karakoram highway okay so the whole day you know I wish to keep blasting away you know you could see geopolitics live in front yeah we saw it unfold you know and uh we could even see the satellite systems that these uh the enemy used to use uh to overpass our location and also we we we are aware okay if they are watching us probably we are watching them more yeah which is why strategically that particular point is very important yes very critical yes which is why it's guarded almost throughout the year


which is why it's guarded almost throughout the year and I don't want to say the winter because what happens there in the winter honestly Winters is very excruciating you know there's a lot of blizzards that take place it's it's um kind of left alone right like there's no one who serves during the winter no no no no it's it's occupied see it's occupied yeah with time and technology and the kind of equipment we have these are occupied throughout the year now one second so when you're saying minus 30 degrees Celsius I'm assuming you're talking about the summer yeah yeah yeah yeah so how cold does it get during the winter you see it remains almost at part at this temperature itself it goes up to minus 70 minus 80. so there we are told during our training in battle school that if you go into the crevasse you do not have more than half an hour to survive so this is what they tell us in training that every step you take think twice follow the


training that every step you take think twice follow the drills what's the logic of a crevice like uh is it that as you're walking on land suddenly something can open up and you can fall in see it's it's all ice that you're walking on basically it's all compact ice so ice is of different density it is literally hard ice crystallized eyes you know I mean even if you would fire a bullet into it probably the bullet would not even go more than uh like 15 centimeters Beyond you know that tough eyes so uh the density of ice is different then you know the these uh the ice is Shifting and melting constantly speaking about that so what usually happens is the top layer of the eyes is visible because you know ice snow keeps falling constantly so the the the snowflakes they keep interlocking and you know it becomes like a carpet you know so yeah so we keep probing every step we take first we probe with the rod to check whether you know the rod is going


rod to check whether you know the rod is going to go right in means they are a lot of depth to it so let's check so with the ice X then we you know remove the eyes to check so if there is a gap in between it's your lucky day you didn't go in so probably you change your route but usually we Mark Our Roots and we know that this is the actual route that we keep taking but you know when there's a lot of snowfall that track gets covered again so you go to again you know it's a task again that you've got to recheck recheck recheck because the ice keeps shifting so we can't take things for granted can't do that every step you take have you fallen in no no no like and it's a luck Factor about you following it's yeah you could say it's all luck a destiny you know it's you know that's what I say it's like on the edge it's like you know you've got to accept few things in life you know I


got to accept few things in life you know I can't move on you know with the fear of fact that's what I you know that is how we are programmed you know like get it on here if I'm in I mean my fight is now how to come out of it I think this is a great point to actually begin speaking about Sudan and we've had Colonel berwan on the show okay give us a little brief kind of insight into the situation in South Sudan uh you've been there for two years of your life probably I would argue in the prime of your career you served in Sudan yes immediately after seeing immediately after so you're done with siachin you've seen a version of hell I see hell almost you got a break of a bit maybe or maybe you didn't even get a break six to seven months that to Preparing physically training hard getting to know about the south Sudanese culture which is what traditions Customs okay it's it's see the division of Khartoum


okay it's it's see the division of Khartoum and juba is North Sudan and juba is South Sudan is was based on religion so khatum is Muslim dominated and South Sudan is Christian dominated okay then they consist of two multiple tribes but the main tribes which are there are Dinka tribe and the Nova tribe so president salvakir is a Dinka and vice president Rick mashar is a newer so in 1992 there was a rift between these two tribes where a lot of dinkas were massacred and probably that Fallout took place unfortunately in 2013. where the dinkas then head back at the newers however the numbers were the ones who tried to and there things went beyond out of control and uh the few footages where I have I have reported about tanks firing at people there by the rebels and we were also a constant Target there so in 2013 we were to move in and you know excitement was there but things drastically changed the day we had


was there but things drastically changed the day we had to go on the first flight to South Sudan from the same flight I was the nominated nominated officer from my paltan to receive mortal remains of Lieutenant Colonel mahipal he was from mechanized infantry and for uh other other ranks to Jovan's hey uh who were ambushed in boar of Maha regiment so it was a very eerie and a very a goosebump kind of a feeling where cargo terminal say I was getting the paperwork done receiving the Mortal remains and side by side I was seeing my troops lined up going to board the same aircraft inside so that was a point of time as an officer I was in a dilemma and I knew that where we are going to go right now is not what everyone has been perceiving it to be everybody's mindset changed un posting is you know usually seen as the prestigious posting is the cream of the Indian army you know we are representatives of our nation you


you know we are representatives of our nation you know so it's the best of the best that go there or foreign soil to operate and you know with that mindset it is something like you know that Black Hawk Down kind of a scenario like the truth moving out from the air base into the city to get the guys out so it was something like that that we are going to enter into a country where you know [ __ ] just hit the fan and There Is No Escape because the terrain is such there is no place for cover what about the Sudanese Army it's called spla so do these people Liberation Army so basically they have a warlord kind of a system so every area has the this is Indian language so they are the people who gets the maximum number of Fighters is given a rank accordingly so you know a coral could be a guy of age of 30 year old and he's just recruited a lot of young yeah he's got like 200 guys with him so they joined the


got like 200 guys with him so they joined the spla they get trained and everything and and I think being a warlord is very important in a modern country like that and probably even being aligned with the warlord is very important just simply to provide for your own family you've seen that movie 13 hours secret soldiers of Benghazi you know what are the Saving Grace of that particular CIA Safe House the local militia they got them out from there you mean life so you've got to see initially the the spla is a amalgamation of both the tribes tribe so all is well till they are together and all is smooth no difference is happening but the day when a field military coup took place on the 6th of December 2013. around 6 to 700 news were massacred in Juba and once the news was out that Rick mashar has fled Yuba and it was a failed attempted coup on president salvakir was a Dinka so what actually went chaotically very wrong was in


so what actually went chaotically very wrong was in military barracks uh troops went rogue wow so everywhere you know we were hearing gunshots everywhere like the soldiers turned into the soldiers turned onto themselves there were very few units which had a compact uh Team of Dinka Noah together but otherwise uh the lot of defection taking place the newer Commanders who were you know the formation commanders they defected from the spla from with weapons with every Arsenal everything right from tanks to weapons to ammunition to troops to Logistics and administrative support they said pack your bags let's move out and we'll regroup and we'll come and we'll hit them back again so it was so chaotic you know the initial six months of 2013 till the month of December things were like quite okay like it was fine we focused on our uh training aid and weapon systems and regular routine and schedule that we had interactions with the UN staff and training modules taking place for troops regarding human rights and Protocols of fire


for troops regarding human rights and Protocols of fire fire drills and everything and uh but at the back of the Mind 10th of April 2013 that we had received mortal remains so be careful eventually six December things went wrong and on 20 on 19th of December evening four o'clock there was an attack at a temporary operating base in okobo where around 3000 Noor tribes took over a U.N base which was being run by uh which was occupied by our troops even troops and how many troops do you think were there uh we had approximately a plateausen there 30 people 30 30 boys and uh they had 46 Dinka refugees which included people of all ages including pregnant women young girls boys elderly uh couples young couples 46 So eventually when they came they overpowered uh the whole site and all were armed and they did not give any reaction time and they shot all 46 refugees yeah and they looted the whole camp and a lot many things happened which probably I'll not disclose because


things happened which probably I'll not disclose because 3 000 people 3000 Rebels with ammunition yeah proper armed along with machetes because for them ammunition is very critical so if they find an unarmed person so they use a measure T rather than wasting a bullet what was the life of civilians at this time and this kind of a situation is breaking out uh overnight we were not prepared overnight we had 15 000 refugees walk into our camps so where are where are uh barracks and accommodation was so refugees were right outside it was it was filled like jam-packed in fact the cemented Pathways that we had we could literally tell them that please get aside we need to pass by things were that bad the whole city the city of malakal was totally overrun there was a charge of thousands of rebels onto our around our log base is it the same one you showed me yes and scary it's like it's way worse than what I've seen in the movie Blood Diamond which


than what I've seen in the movie Blood Diamond which showed sort of a version of uh Sierra Leone being overrun by rebels this was way worse what you actually showed me yeah I mean you see the actual footage there were child soldiers I saw uh Rebels with amputed arms carrying a AK with just one arm and even cocking that AK with their foot and again getting ready to fight I have seen soldiers of the spla come at the U.N gate and with his one hand he's taking out his imputed hand and gesturing doctor put it back and he had gangrene smelling lot of lies and probably a little bit of maggots there he was injured for probably two days my God and uh blood red eyes on drugs this guy came up to the gate and the protocol is they have to surrender their weapon note on the names you sent to the hospital this guy was operated and this is a doctor a colonel in the hospital where I made a call I said one guy is


where I made a call I said one guy is coming he's carrying his amputed hand in his pocket just just see to himself I'll do that obviously was disposed of got it done his wounds this guy gets up on the second day comes back at the gate and says give me back my weapon I said sorry we've destroyed it that's what our protocol says it's been destroyed how did he react he didn't react much he just walked out with uh the glucose the drip that he had he just walked out what does this do to you as an observer as an observer I tried my best I told the hospital staff outside the spla people already there to take him with him with them and I realized this is not going to stop if this is the level of approach that they have despite losing a hand after 48 Hours the guy is not even healed he's ready to again go back without a hand into combat I said where does it end yeah you know you said something very interesting


it end yeah you know you said something very interesting outside so he said that the Special Forces is efficiency oriented and they're supposed to cause chaos in Enemy Lines Behind Enemy Lines uh the Infantry has to deal with chaos being thrown at them and then figuring out what to do in the chaos and everything that you're saying about Sudan is exactly that kind of a situation it's just chaotic you don't know who's against who you just know everyone's aggressive everyone's out for each other's life um now you're talking about the soldier who had his own hand in his pocket and then went back into you know the war zone like it was just normal in fact the moment when he put his hand in the pocket to take out his hand to show it to us my boy's already cocked their weapons and pointed it onto his head because that has also happened exactly and the worst case scenario was the rebel forces and the government forces were almost in the same uniform they were just they


were almost in the same uniform they were just they had just one band onto their arm the rebel forces um for the viewers of this podcast we just took a two-minute pause in the middle it might seem like it's continuous for you on the edit but we took a two-minute pause because this is where the chat gets a little bit intense so you've taken off your Blazer yes I'm like let's get it all now yeah let's let's talk a little bit more about this you just spoke about the mindset of the people there so um I want to ask you what it's like when you're facing these people in combat see the moment there was a touchdown from the aircraft on South Sudan or tarmac the kind of perception that you're having airports um so we got closer to reality the sooner we started moving to our bases bases were approximately 500 kilometers away from each other the most effective and quickest means of Community Transportation was by hepta so we knew there is no backup we on


so we knew there is no backup we on our own so it was by on the 19th of December where I was I was telling you attacked water we lost two ratios one ah Rifleman mundle was shot to the right side of his chest gunshot wound this is all in skirmishes this is when the the newers came and attacked and killed those 46 refugees and overran the Kobo camp and everything and the worst part is that the the newer officials were part of the government came much later into the picture they should have been the before to stop things happen they came after everything was over there we got a fair picture that things are going to unfold in terms of demography are going to get hit so we were to prepare ourselves accordingly at all our locations so malakal is the upper Nile state which is adjoining it is very oil Rich refineries were left in oil wells were left in South Jordan so the issue here was that because oil content is so high that if they


that because oil content is so high that if they try to do farming and they try to do digging and all oil is there so it's restricted you know so that is why firstly there are lot of poverty of farming importance in everything and so when this attack took place then on 20th of December then the hectors went in and we got back our boys and everything uh bmps were there left there they were disabled how did those guys survive there's 3 000 people facing 30 people the local newer officials made it very clear to the rebels that you touch these guys these Indian troops the other things will go out of proportion so these three thousand Rebels just came for the 46 refugees exactly wow and they they tried not to harm the 30 jawans much yes but in this skirmish these warrant officers came in tried to intervene and they were so high on drugs the the Rebels the rebels young guys they shot them point blank in the chest as in


they shot them point blank in the chest as in as in they said don't kill these refugees let's talk what is the issue let's sit and talk they are unarmed but they overthrew you know they just took the day they uh almost kidnapped uh troops with weapons and everything over part them and things were really not it was the most unexpected thing to happen there the least expected ever that was a place which was in isolation nothing there it is just that they got the news of Archer 46 refugees okay let's go in that's where things went ugly you spoke about these guys being high on drugs yeah what drugs I really don't know they were taking some pills you know and the bloodshot eyes they were child soldiers most dreaded element why Child Soldier you walking by in a petrol you're going in a vehicle you just know don't know what's in the kid's mind you might just um caught the weapon in fact the weapons were always cocked these were AK-47 AK-47 they


were always cocked these were AK-47 AK-47 they had rounds in the chamber already so they never had to you know follow any drill it will just point out and that's it it's very difficult for a civilian to wrap his or her head around this you know trained inventory veteran you know what it's like using weapons you've trained people in using weapons you have kids yourself you have two sons yes how do you mix the Two Worlds of weaponry and battle with the child's mind I I try my best not to discuss anything in terms of combat with my children I mean they're too young my eldest son is still five years old so he still remembers little bit of my slithering from the helicopter and when we were at you know jumping is to see these troops to you know do the free Falls and everything he has very faded memories of it but I try not to stress on to that because you see at an early age if I expose my child to combat stories and everything


if I expose my child to combat stories and everything so by the time he's in 10th or 12 for him it will be just a normal thing you know and knowingly what about these African kids and how how young was the youngest child Soldier I'll tell you what is the actual scenario that they face I was at a port location where the ships dock I saw a kid almost at the same age of my eldest son which is five five four or five years old he had a lock he had a threat tied to the hook of the lock he had at regular interval hooks of the threat like Loops coming out knots in that he put few grains of rice took it over our pocket rice and few kids gave him worms okay I didn't know what exactly was doing with that later on I found out he's throwing the lock right into the water and then he's pulling it pulling it pulling it so there's a fish called tilapia in the River Nile so I saw him for


in the River Nile so I saw him for almost two and a half hours that was a route which was once the War Began so the Inland uh roads were almost blocked so it was the waterways through which through which the world food program used to get the food and everything to these badges these ships so I just went and I saw and I called Meg what are you doing he said I am arranging for food for myself that's a very apparent so he said they're dead so I said whom are you with Kathy these are my group of friends with no parents so I said so how do you manage so he said we listen to our boss so that's one Elder kid compared to others in age probably seven or eight years wow just a bunch of small kids and they get something they that's their food and they're also taught how to use weapons the child soldiers were probably eight or nine years plus of age probably they knew how to use it that is why they were carrying the


to use it that is why they were carrying the AKs you know as a young officer of the Indian army you know you always are full of Josh and jasba Junoon and you know yeah and through about okay let's get this on and I want to see combat and all and trust me I I at times you know when I sit back and I think I think I wished a bit too much which I Repent because these are the memories which are etched into my mind till the day I die are you still healing from them it's not about healing it's about uh as a warrior I feel we were destined by God to experience this it has made us mentally more strong and robust and I don't see any healing aspect in it I see a lot of learning aspect in it what did you lose I learned life is unforgiving survival of the fittest air if you don't make a move either like termites the system will eat you up you'll be finished else you make the first


you up you'll be finished else you make the first move and save yourself if you don't make a move the other person is going to make a move and your head is going to be on the table so you know Katana it's better to use sweat and bleed in peace well I mean you sweat more In Peace So that you bleed Less in war so for us as infantarians you know it's uh during training it's wet and even bleed for us during peace because that Fear Factor you can't live with you got to live without fear without fear I mean the thing that pushes a human mind to face fear is fear itself so that is one it's an antidote virus which was injected into us so to overcome fear you have to face fear yeah while you've had a very very intense conversation right now this is one of the conversations where I've spoken the least because I could just feel the things you were saying and I didn't want to stop you anyway I


and I didn't want to stop you anyway I just wanted you to talk about the truth on the show I think that's what people got to know um it's very important stories like this are exposed to the public we didn't have access to these stories when I was in college when I was in school and I feel like more people need to know the greatness of our military Armed Forces so on behalf of the youth services thank you for your service thank you really appreciate you huge opening up on the first level I'm proud to be talking to you for such a long time that you gave me so much of your time so uh I do feel there are many more conversations yet to be had with you definitely uh but seriously thank you for everything and thank you for this conversation it means you're awesome you're welcome ranveer and I have a lot of messages for the Youth but probably we'll do it yeah you're going to get a flood of DMS uh you know I mean direct


flood of DMS uh you know I mean direct messages on your Instagram and all that I mean you got to push yourself then it's good happen and moreover today's youth needs to be guided you know like the agnivir uh project you know it's practical it is logical yes sir I mean you know you could get the cream into the forces because that lethargy element is going to be taken out you know that lack of acidical uh uh thing you know mindset that's all going to be negated yeah here you've got to get boys who mean business who do well will shine well they'll get promoted on time and they're going to do justice to another but you know the government you know there's a limit to the load and pressure of what it can take look at the size we are the second most populated country in the world that you expect the economy to be thriving and doing amazingly well but on the same lines you want facilities also so where is the government going to make the


also so where is the government going to make the savings where is the government going to make the gains I mean you know you've got to you know ask not what the nation can do for you but uh what you can do for the nation first unconditional contribution join the agniwir project the government is put its mind and soul into it has put in good logic into it and the youth is going to get a good direction Society is going to become more refined karaoke 75 Joe uh they will be adjusted into the other forces so you can imagine you're going to get killed soldiers who would be uh situationally be more aware who will be well cultured well-mannered they'll be more of gentlemen there'll be more respect to the ladies in the society a environment of that being safe is will be there you know like how it is in Israel you know the conscript yeah they go in for mandatory service who do well carry on otherwise those who who wish to uh who are not taken into the


who wish to uh who are not taken into the uh forces get into the Civil Society and are doing decently well so definitely the Civil arena is not going to overlook them or exploit their skill set by giving them low salaries they will be imbibed and absorbed in the society the standard of society is going to go up so logic uh project being criticized whereas the it's going to upgrade the the character of the youth it's going to make them more refined more gentlemanly well trained and in an emergency wherever a country requires more troops at any given point of time it's just going to be announcement and these troops are battle ready and onto the front and ready to face so probably even the enemy wouldn't be able to comply or put logical statistical data so just go to boost everything in a tremendous manner so you know this is a futuristic concept and if you got to move on you got to accept changes you can't be rigid so wherever we are heading


you can't be rigid so wherever we are heading we're heading in a very correct direction and I probably we are going to discuss the current affairs aspect in terms of warfare Urban Warfare and everything so yeah so that's how things are going to move forward you see major tour learned a lot from you on this one conversation looking forward to more that's what I'll say thank you sir you're welcome Jain cool that was the military special of this month we've decided internally to always have these military specials released on the podcast every single month if you're not following a Hindi podcast I strongly suggest you go follow it it's on our Hindi Channel there's even more military conversations that we've uploaded onto that channel on that podcast if you don't want to consume the entire podcast we have a highlights channel it's called TRS Clips we'll link it down below and of course make sure you follow us on Spotify every episode's available on Spotify 48 hours before it's available anywhere else in


Spotify 48 hours before it's available anywhere else in the world one request to you guys is that I would like to know who else you guys would like featured on the runway show when it comes to the military when it comes to people related to the secret Services when it comes to people related to any aspect of national security or State security let me know send in your guest suggestions I'm ranveer alabadia and TRS will return pretty much in three days because we do two podcast releases every single week thanks for the support we'll see you soon [Music] thank you


the newest building cannot also be the oldest or the tallest or the most like the biggest bull right because we evolve people had the Eiffel Tower 100 years ago they go there they study the Eiffel Tower and they make it better then they build a taller better structure they will see in Tower right but then people from Dubai go to CN Tower they study that structure and then they build Burj Khalifa 20 years from now we know it is not going to be Burj Khalifa right because its evolution of technique right we keep on improving now archaeologists confirm that yes these pillars are made using lathe technology okay we can see the turn marks when you make a pot you will see lines in that pot okay because they're constantly rotating and experts they're embarrassed to admit this right because they don't want to admit this but they admit it yes free don't know how but they use late machines to make these pillars so the lathe machine must have been maybe like 300 400


the lathe machine must have been maybe like 300 400 meters long bro which is a huge lathe machine yes Praveen Mohan one of the most requested guests that we've ever brought on the show people have been requesting for an episode with him since 2019 since the podcast began the reason we couldn't do it earlier was that Praveen Mohan spends most of his time exploring ancient sites in India as well as the world trying to uncover the truths about the past that may have been forgotten in a world that quickly shuns and quickly downplays possible alternative history theories Praveen Mohan is going about these archaeological missions by himself on his own budget he's documenting only 10 of it and releasing it on his YouTube channel and that 10 is enough to Fascinate an entire nation That's The Power of this man's experiences there's a couple of episodes we did on this particular day and they were both about the remaining 90 percent the kind of stuff that he can't talk about


percent the kind of stuff that he can't talk about easily on his YouTube channel if you're a Praveen Mohan subscriber you're in for a lot of content that's possibly not made it onto his fantastic Vlogs and if you're not a Praveen Mohan subscriber I promise you that by the end of both these episodes you will become one for more episodes like this make sure you follow the renvi show on Spotify for Spotify exclusive of every episode's available on Spotify 48 hours before it's available anywhere else in the world before I let you slip into these fantastic episodes I want to highlight that level super mind our meditation app is now live everything from beginners to intermediate to Advanced guided meditations sleep stories sleep meditations all of it is available on the app make sure you download it the link is given down below and now I'll let you slip into a perspective building conversation this is part one of our special with Praveen Mohan [Music] thank you Praveen Mohan sir the most requested


thank you Praveen Mohan sir the most requested Tiaras episode in recent times for show and possibly Of All Times how are you sir good how are you I love that rematching right now with our colors uh I love that we're both Engineers I love the way YouTubers and I love that we have this Fascination for ancient India how are you I'm good I'm good glad to be here thank you for having me I'm so pumped about just opening up this topic about ancient India with you I think uh history is not taught to us in schools in the Indian education system the way it should be taught and I don't blame the education system honestly I feel the people who wrote our history books were confined to the history that was discovered possibly in the 80s or early 90s and in the last 30 years history has changed on a global scale people have realized so much because so much more of the Earth's crust has been dug into so we're re-realizing history uh but probably


into so we're re-realizing history uh but probably the education system is not keeping up uh you're also a 90s kid so would you agree when I say these things um yeah well some parts of this I agree okay um but history was written like 100 200 years ago the books that we read today all the kids read today they were written maybe 100 years ago right and there was a calculation behind this there's a calculated bias that's put into the history month right um that misinformation spreads but as we become more and more globalized um because 50 years ago if somebody's sitting in India and saying something a person in Germany is not going to be able to listen to it right but today as we globalize more the information we find any historian finds or what you find if you go to elephanta caves and then you find this information you're immediately able to throw it on YouTube or other social media and that gets spread to millions of people so we are able to see it as a fact that


we are able to see it as a fact that history books are um full of misinformation okay um I I think that you've always been destined to do what you're doing right now so there must have been some internal fascination with what you're doing right now and a lot of people in the mainstream know you as someone who's showcasing the secrets as well as the knowledge of temples in India now keeping this in mind please correct me if I'm wrong sir but uh because we've been invaded so much over the years um you know I think this is the first generation of Indians basically or the first three generations which are not under some sort of invasion after like 1000 years like 1 000 years of people before us have been invaded which means that a lot of the temples especially in North India and probably even Central India have been destroyed but South India has a lot of temples and a lot of ancient secrets that are still intact yes um so I'm assuming that you do have a


yes um so I'm assuming that you do have a bit more focus on the temples of the South and that the secrets are still kind of locked in yes I mean I do get blamed I am a South Indian obviously and I do get blamed a lot for this right why do you only cover South India and whenever we put temples from North India it blows up people a lot of people watch it but I do get blamed why are you always focusing on South India because that's what's left exactly because most of the temples in the north and in the central part of India are already demolished and this is the funny part because um a lot of people from North will say Praveen Mohan why are you not posting anything from North India the answer is you guys don't have anything left and a lot of people in South India when when people from the north come to South India right they're always mocking them saying that oh you guys don't have any actual temples right you guys


don't have any actual temples right you guys don't have any really ancient Hindu temples all the temples are actually in South India right the north India is very socially politically active right the northern part of India is socially politically active about Hinduism they're always like hindutua you know it's it's very open in politics and the south is not so much as you can see and the South always marks the north Indians saying that oh but all the temples are here but what they don't understand what the South Indians don't understand is only because all the north Indians were fighting the Invaders so hard that they still have the temples left in South India right if the north Indians were not fighting that much they were not protecting against the Invaders there would be no temples in South India so they don't understand that just pause for a second All My Love to Tamil Nadu Punjabi Pride go on go on yeah so so this is the idea so the the so-called


so so this is the idea so the the so-called divide between the northern it's out basically exists because we don't understand each other and you know in all honesty India is a bunch of different countries put together United by culture um keeping that in mind you've visited a lot of temples man you visited more temples than four of my grandparents put together so uh which one has stayed with you the longest I'm not asking you your favorite I'm asking the one that stayed with you the longest where you couldn't get it out of your head each Temple is different um I used to have many favorite places like when I went to kailasa Temple uh I thought nobody can build a better Temple than the kailasa temple it's made of just one stone where is it it's in ellora caves it's in Aurangabad it's very close to Mumbai and uh the way they built it normally how do you build temples right so you start from the ground level you keep on putting one


start from the ground level you keep on putting one stone block up on top and you build the temple this is how you're supposed to build anything but the kailasa temple is completely different so they stored from The Mountaintop they remove the Rocks they scooped out the room the extra rocks and what is left out is a temple that is the kailasa temple it's made of one stone there's no metal there's no wooden blocks there's no extra Stone added to it and this Temple has so many features it has like a a bridge enacting one part to another and it has so many chambers and pillars all made of just one stone and I mean honestly it should be named as a world wonder if you will right if it was built anywhere outside India it would have probably been you know considered as a wonder of the world but because we don't promote these kind of monuments it's just now it's getting popular but it's not well known yet yeah that's what a lot


not well known yet yeah that's what a lot of people have said in the podcast that India has a dormant tourism industry like it's going to blow up when uh Indians decide that it's time for it to blow up but I think that's what you're doing through your content um I do have so many other questions about uh kind of more esoteric things about the temples uh I know you have like this whole intuitive side we were talking about palm reading on the outside and uh at the cost of asking a slightly personal question have you had like a spiritual childhood or teenage which allows you to be this kind of fascinated naturally fascinated by these temples like do you understand them on a deeper level I don't know how I got this perspective uh but I grew up in temples so this this gave me a huge Advantage because I grew up inside temples so all the Hindu temples in Tamil Nadu they close around 11 o'clock in the morning and


they close around 11 o'clock in the morning and then they only open up at like five o'clock so between 11 to 5 nobody's allowed inside the temple and the temples are huge okay the temples are not just one Shrine or something like this it'll take you maybe an like half hour to walk around their their big temples so I had the opportunity uh to be inside the temple from 11 to five when nobody was there um so I used to spend a lot of time inside the temples um talking like I was very young I was maybe six seven years old at that time and this happened between six to ten years old so I would go to the gods and they would kind of talk to them right because when you're that young you're basically like looking at a character in TV yeah and you're talking to them so it's very interesting to me saying that why is this God um carved this way right and there are many different things like so there's one God called deaf God