uh but as they grow older especially as actors they feel like young younger parts but i think that's a misconception that that that attitude should change because um you want to do good paths and you want to be able to do all of it and actually if you are 32 or 33 then why don't you want to test for a 30 to 33 year old because that's your actual age yeah and you might get a life changing role which is building which is what i think people should overall focus on is to to do the parts that are good and not focus on you type casting i i understand i think at some point what used to happen like let's see for the actor's best friend it was a very type casted situation like people would always feel like okay friends and vicky kaushal broke that vicky gosh broken a lot of stereotypes and motions yeah because he was gutsy he took on parts uh and he really killed it in those parts so you stopped seeing him as any best friend you


so you stopped seeing him as any best friend you just were like he's an actor and he's really doing well at what he's doing you know how they say that it gets easy to earn uh fame or money but it's difficult to earn respect yeah i feel vicky caution is one person who's done that and i would say the same about you like i feel like you've earned a lot of respect like indeed and this is me speaking to you purely i feel like those isn't that what you want to be known for i don't want to be known for only some big blockbuster films that i'm casting for i want to be known for the kind of work atmosphere i'm setting up the kind of notions i'm putting for the few for the future generation to come the the things that i'm stating are important for the move forward we're we're now what i call like in the new era of acting uh it's a new world that we're building we're going towards a more natural we were


building we're going towards a more natural we were talking about this outside otd yeah we're going towards a more natural form of acting uh you know scene work has become very very uh the way that we perform scenes is not today our rehearsals and our takes are not very different from each other when we record in the studio we do a bunch of rehearsals and then we do a few takes but we don't want actors to suddenly become something else and the camera comes on we want it to be as natural as possible that's the kind of acting that we we want to do dude loki does everyone want to get into films yeah everyone will say oh no i'm okay with what i'm doing a large part of india wants to he wants to be at the movies it's i've rarely come across someone will be like named bilkul now of course there are people that will say that but most people will be like try to girl times we'll give it a shot why not why not


times we'll give it a shot why not why not and you never know you know you'll be surprised sometimes we've come across so much talent like that we're just like people who after a long time in their life have always kind of had it in their heart but have done a corporate job and then they feel like they actually hamilton and i think that's that's where people like me come in because like i was saying sometimes i do have to give a reality check to people no this this when you come into my office space you are here because you want to be an actor so don't get too looped in in how you're looking how your hair is which profile is better forget about all that like come in and do the scene because then i know that you are focused on being a good actor yeah so you're not like too looped into how uh your physical appearance is in fact i don't think that's the least important once you come into the studio osap garcia blow dry and make up


studio osap garcia blow dry and make up and for the boys like nice look and once you come into the studio and we are putting the camera in front of you forget about all of that just focus on doing the scene well and i think today in today's time we see it with ott it's a huge shift people only good actors are being noticed are being appreciated that time of your time is only gone where like you know just it's just a pretty face and don't know how to act as like people are now at the word go i get told if they're not good actors let's not test them and there is sort of a path from theater to ott into films of course ott is completely translating into film people are picking up actors from ott to put them into the movies so today that a mindset of don't want to do ott small screen don't want to do ott it's completely going you know shakun said something really and that's kind of still stayed with me he's like


that's kind of still stayed with me he's like i've never seen because when ghanaia was coming on ott and i asked him i was like we were having a conversation at our rap party and i was like you know what do you feel about that is that something like a lot of directors would have been like oh this is such a big cast we should do a theatrical release shakun was like i never saw the uh ott as a small screen because i grew up watching my woody allen films on my laptop so he was like this was my world so i don't see that as a bad thing and i think that that's such a progressive thought and coming from a um like one of the most established directors that we have in bollywood to say something so progressive and do something so progressive it's it's given such a big push to the younger generation of um directors that we're gonna have or even to go with someone so new for music and he's done a phenomenal


so new for music and he's done a phenomenal oaf and a kabir which has done such a phenomenal job with the music not like shakun didn't have the um he had the reach to go to anyone but you know he chose to give someone be collaborative give someone you a chance he took that chance even upon me because he was you know he met me and he had never worked with me before when we had worked on kapoor and sons but he took that gamble he was like okay cool yeah you you're some new energy you'll sort my cast out right i'm like i'll sort it out and it resulted in an iconic film yeah i mean we all love components i have a question to ask you i'm allowed to do that yes okay that's the voice okay okay great uh so basically i am new to this world that is very very familiar to you which is this youtube content creator world because when you do say influencers and you say ott i only think like amazon


and you say ott i only think like amazon netflix like all the otd platforms and i think influencers for me is like fashion influencers and influencers on instagram but there's a whole world out there on youtube right what is that world like like how much has it evolved and where is it going um anyone who crosses 100k youtube subscribers or i'd say 500k instagram followers okay is smart dedicated and has a vision that's how they've been able to scale that much okay so that's the basis and i'm trying to quantify the basis uh okay it is easy to get up to those marks under those marks based on a little bit of luck like you make one reel that takes over one man but if you can get to those points right i think that's the qualification for me in terms of i'll look at that person as a serious media professional okay my second gauge is are they uh spread across platforms you can't just be on one platform and we see even hyper established people on just


platform and we see even hyper established people on just one platform the real uh strength of a brand happens across according to me okay uh as i said i think it's a stepping stone to do other in life um in terms of youtube people are watching huh like it's crazy the amount of content people and if people have channels and all they're really people are following specific channels like religiously like you will put a video up and people will want to watch it like then and then okay like that let me ask you why why in in its core what's the logic for a human being to go watch a film it's entertainment uh it's feel good what is the need for entertainment for the human being um i guess to let off stress to some sort of escapism yeah escapism of course when it comes to youtube fiction serves the same purpose so comedy entertainment it's in the same domain as your one yeah correct there's a whole other non-fiction side of beauty where people don't use it to


side of beauty where people don't use it to escape people use it to go deeper into their lives hmm interesting it creates a very different kind of fandom um so numbers are way lesser but the numbers are much more powerful you have ceos founders of startups people like yourself no of course i understand because when i do when i when i think about like eventually if i want to take workshops and stuff i go and see other interviews or i see interviews of other casting directors so i i see because if i'm in a particular department and that content is informative to me and helps me reach somewhere without leaving the confines of my home that's excellent he was saying something very interesting about uh this this whole world hating about bollywood that's kind of like why is that come together i think it's a lot of uh or like looking down are you saying that gen z is not gonna be interested in bollywood or is it something called jen alpha which is younger than


is it something called jen alpha which is younger than gen z okay what is j okay jen alpha that's new that's after 2005 or 2007. and you're saying they are like they're not interested they are just into youtube okay yeah which means youtube will get bigger yeah which might uh be a rebuttal to your hypothesis yeah and i am not uh what's it called shooting down your hypothesis no no of course uh i think you're a media professional no but again when we uh like i said that when you say influencers i think a lot more instagram and less youtube because our generation saw that 2010 2009 we saw fashion influencers yeah correct doing photos on instagram that i feel like is a bubble in mind that's gone yeah i run like a time management that's gone like no money money's channelized towards people who just do photos like the money is only towards video people and i'll tell you a sort of conundrum okay tell me uh which is that so we're content creators and


uh which is that so we're content creators and imagine getting numbers as like walking up a mountain okay so we're walking yeah and each piece of content is one step you're taking in the upward direction and then you see that some piece of fiction has come out on ott or in theaters and someone has gone from getting a thousand likes on their post to a million likes in one week and you're like okay i'm climbing the mountain here and someone's got a lift to the top oh which made me understand the power of fiction which made me kind of change my opinions from being like oh no i just do non-fiction and we're better and we're cooler too oh this is the true power of fictional fiction so uh okay that's interesting and there's evolutionary psychology behind this because we need roti caprara human beings and we need storytelling yeah storytelling so that's very interesting yeah totally different world than mine i feel like now i now i'm suddenly feeling like i'm living under


now i'm suddenly feeling like i'm living under the rock no but do you have more questions about this no it's interesting definitely to know because it's such a different world from the world that i am in also what you what you do in con your kind of content and my content is so different my content is like auditions and it's almost like a two-way emotional experience with an actor you know also there's so much um there's so much trust involved in you know when i have to when we take auditions and i have to tell an actor uh the truth about what they've done and how they have to change that it's a completely different content world than what what you guys do you know at youtube but i'm what i'm trying to think is that how can the two worlds come together is what is like uh is something that's on my mind but that's when the when the business side of things becomes rich enough to produce movies yeah or when uh panchamikhari decides to cast all


or when uh panchamikhari decides to cast all the entertainment youtubers in films that's i can do i think i'm already in the process of doing that yeah they are very hungry for it honestly the whole entertainment space on youtube is very but yeah that's amazing and also if you have like a bunch of people under in your you you said that you have a like a sister company that has talent under it for time to make that connect no for me great but i'm also speaking on behalf of the whole the whole ecosystem but to be honest somehow it's sad that that connect has not happened because we are already constantly looking for talent and we don't care where the people have come from i don't care if they're from another city from another country as far as they can speak the language and they're enthusiastic and uh they are interested in acting the narrative and the assumption is that a lot of content creators don't look as good as a conventional movie


creators don't look as good as a conventional movie star but we don't care about that anymore we don't care about that that's a misconception we're not only chasing looks when it comes to especially ott has got that change that has happened it's very real we are not chasing only good looks or six-pack abs and all that six-pack abs or like your martial arts and all whatever you're trained in like but i also think because i want actors to know this the world of portfolio pictures has officially left the building we don't care i mean i don't care and i'm i'm i mean i'm just saying it out on on behalf of other casting directors i don't know if everyone will agree with me for me in my space i don't care if you've gone to a big photographer and spend one lakh rupees or seventy thousand on eighty thousand to get your portfolio pictures done it doesn't matter to me i need a bunch of nice pictures natural most pro like most likely in


of nice pictures natural most pro like most likely in a white t-shirt and blue jeans against a white wall natural smiling happy pictures that's all we are looking for we don't want some big bikini look and indian look and you know six pack the shirtless look for boys i was like we don't need all of that we don't need it i swear you know sometimes you hear a phrase and then you have to just blurt out a line of a song i just want to scream beginning shoot i'm making issues you don't want that but it's sad because like especially tier two tier three when these guys come down they feel like that's one of the things they have to do immediately oh scene acting casting audition skills portfolio pictures i'm like that but that used to be there i don't think that's there anymore in today's time we don't really care about it it's not like uh um it's not like a checklist thing you have to do i have to ask you just one question in their


i have to ask you just one question in their hand in my head for a very long is it gonna this isn't one of those shows this is just i mean dude honestly this process of podcasting is just my own question which i have for people uh why do you fold your arms like when when you talk is it just like uh is it just like no i actually do that even when i'm standing okay i don't know i ask you from the perspective that i've started doing it and uh not after this conversation in life yeah i do this all the time i just feel comfortable and i used to make i mean i have made body language based content where this is like kind of supposed to be sort of a red flag when your listener is doing that to you oh yeah so what do you mean say that again if i'm saying something and you fold your arms it usually like 70 to 80 percent of the time those are very raw numbers which i've just thrown in but anyway it means that


i've just thrown in but anyway it means that i've said something that has uh kind of made you feel a little bit guarded oh like maybe something accusational or some assumption about you which you don't agree with okay but i've also come to realize that it could be just also could be like a like a like a habit a habit that helps you think better okay because i've started doing it with my team when i have to so say no because i have like four different things i do right okay and if one team is asking me something very difficult i have to switch off the three other things and just let that yeah yeah tell me about it multitasking yeah yeah one engine uh thing and this helps me switch on one engine and switch off the other three okay i'm gonna be more like i'm gonna be more mindful to see when i do it or lead people around you yeah and try understanding what's happening in their heads and it works dude body language is one of those things


it works dude body language is one of those things that's changed my life you know what it does like if you get deep into body language yeah and there's like 10 or 20 like these kind of core rules of body language but if you learn them it's little like you can spot when people lie you can kind of start reading what people are thinking for example damn interesting yeah yeah yeah i learned a little bit about body language when i was doing this lease transport course because there are a lot of things in a scene that you start doing because you're trying to keep connected with yourself but you're trying to be punched me but actually you have to be the other tea that's in the scene so you will start doing like things on the side like people do like rub i've seen this even with actors and i wanted they do a lot of like rubbing their fingers they'll do like tapping they're tapping their feet to cope to to stick you kind of want to stay connected with the real world and not


want to stay connected with the real world and not completely given to a scene but we obviously catch those things and we try to tell actors that you are trying to hold off you're being guarded so try to let go because the thing is that in a scene i keep seeing a little bit of your actual personality come in so you're not completely surrendering to the character that you've been asked to play but that happens in challenging scenes sometimes it it can happen all the time people do a lot more things like they touch sometimes like they'll touch they'll do it like a pulling of their uh skin like so weird yeah it's like a twitch you're very good at conversation okay uh i i i've spoken to enough people to know who's good who's not and also podcasting gives you this ability to really go inside a person's mind have you been able to tell that like have i gone inside your mind yeah i mean we've had conversations far more than just casting right yeah and i


conversations far more than just casting right yeah and i i've got to learn something from you today which i like which makes me very happy this content just content world yeah what's next and what's um what what the world is moving towards to be honest sometimes you're in such a cocoon we don't even know what's happening outside don't don't you think people good people skills become good actors yes yes it is true good people with good people skills will people with good people skills will become good actors yes they will be good actors because they are able to put their life out there they don't have any qualms about talking about their failures and their successes and i think that for an actor i mean like they say as an actor if you if you're able to bring a little bit of your bad times or your tough times into a scene that helps that's what you call method acting right that's what we've been learning for so long so uh it does help to be a little bit more open i


does help to be a little bit more open i wouldn't say all actors are meet are extroverts there are some introverts too but those transform on camera sometimes but i do think people skills are important because it is about sometimes about being at the right place at the right time and then your communication skills do are really important in life so but there are some people who they're two kinds of people one that are just there instantly and one that take time to warm up and i think that that's that's fair yeah there are all kinds of personalities but i feel like for sure people skills are very important factors because even when they come into a casting room how well are they able to strike it with the assistance that they are taking the test how how that equation is also important right so then you can then you'll have the room to be like i've done it the way that but i had prepared it a certain way can i do it my way so if you're able to convey that and sometimes


so if you're able to convey that and sometimes we very well go with the final take will end up being the one that the actor did the way that they wanted because that's that's what they did most honestly so we don't have anything to set in stone so being having good communication skills will always help you you know do maybe even do a better test wow so we've reached the end of this episode yeah uh and and i have like too much conversational chemistry i feel with you but this is easy conversation i mean we're literally sitting here and getting to know each other that was it i said that's the podcast how how do you feel man i feel great are you gonna go back to hustling yeah i am i am i love all these conversations because they make me feel inspired why why do i like these uh lady valley podcast much more dude like it's so much more fun why why men are not making any jokes dude with men it becomes intense it's like all


with men it becomes intense it's like all analytical in our life and you also must be getting into it yeah yeah because i bounce off the other person's energy yeah so the moment i realized you're a happy punjabi chill person i was like okay that that's what we can do today yeah like i don't remember the last funny male podcast because it becomes dirty like it becomes dirty honey translates into dirty and then doesn't make it to the final cut yeah i can imagine no this was great fun i didn't even realize it's been like two hours and be like i know what you're feeling but i am telling you honestly this is like just of completely again personal thought i keep telling vish that i think he's with me because i'm entertaining like i'm like i know what you're doing you just want to be entertained i see that's why you're with me because you because i do make jokes all the time and i'm like a very like i'm also a very


i'm like a very like i'm also a very clumsy person so i keep tripping and like all of those things happen to me they're very real and now it's like it's i only get laughs like if i topple and i fall down which just happened to me in amsterdam or like i missed a step because it's a cobblestone road which will just be laughing i'm like at least help me man help me out don't just laugh so i relate to that uh i've dated i've dated someone like that once used to get into and there is a entertainment factor you feel as long as it's not too physically painful you know what they're going through if it's kind of physically painful is entertaining i think if i was dying then i'd get help then then the the guys you know like night in shining armor wakes up because guys always want to massage their own ego pg i'm not going to ask you for a role or i will ask you for a set


a role or i will ask you for a set me up with someone i'm kidding maybe i can cast you a girl a cast me a girl yeah it's meant to be funny oh she should see because i'm into casting and i cast movies i can pass someone in your life is what i mean i find you funny but but but i don't think i'm like i i mean i really don't know i should interview another casting director to see i don't know what others are like in in whatever their whatever i'm doing i don't know if people have a different like vibe approach have you ever done any other chat no i'm a first casting director yeah you you know you're right uh dude and you've been on my list for a very long time yeah tell me how did you even think of uh it's going to become serious now see now we're going to break away from all this falling and tripping um i've only heard very respectful things about you okay when when people talk about you


things about you okay when when people talk about you there's a lot of respect that people attach to your name and um i've noticed that in the media industry the dark horses and the ones that stay around or build things in the long term always have a sense of respect attached to their name there's never anything sleazy i've ever heard about you never anything bad negative and after talking to you i understand why i understand you know the person you are yeah i'm happy to hear that yeah i think that makes me happy there was a sort of long-term admiration uh and a lot of times i decide okay this person should be on the show and then i just forget until a certain moment like someone's name drops in my head so the universe conspired to make this happen that's amazing that's why i texted you yesterday and we're doing this today yeah can you imagine it just happened so organically and fast it shows uh but i i am very like i'm very uh spontaneous yeah and


am very like i'm very uh spontaneous yeah and you need that in our industry you need to be able to just go for things yeah so and i i i think that um you know honestly when you say that that's really sweet that you've that's what you've heard but really i've just tried to have a strong morals about how i want to lead my life and my company and be at my work and i've had a lot of fun in the process you should see us in our office i don't have any of this weird like hierarchy thing we you know we all eat together we don't have any like it's not like my team can't sit on my chair i don't have all those weird things that a lot of maybe there is this um hierarchy thing that maybe there are many jobs not only in casting and we don't have that it's just like a very equal atmosphere everyone gets to give their opinion uh when i'm confused about a test i'll ask my team what they feel


about a test i'll ask my team what they feel so it's collab it's truly collaborative and maybe that the respect comes out of a little bit of freedom i don't also sit on my team's head to be like monday to saturday office like ladies like you are the reason they say that the world is becoming more matriarchal which is amazing okay like there is like i do feel men have their own unique stuff of course and we're not trying to actually step over one to the other right but we are trying to make the space um equal for all and i think that's important they say if if there was only women in positions of power all over the world politically there would be no more wars isn't that amazing that's such a nice thought i strongly agree with it there will be people who disagree but that's something because you think that women are slightly more sensitive empathetic like that's a strength of being a woman inherent strength yeah and many guys don't develop empathy


strength yeah and many guys don't develop empathy ever so and it is difficult for a guy to have empathy because the narrative you're given as a kid is yeah i understand that i understand that and i try to break a lot of that when we are casting or when we are in the studio to be like listen we don't have you don't have to have all of these like i was like when people get married in my team or like looking to get married no i'm like don't be that that's like you want the wife who's gonna i was like you we gotta push this envelope for further right we have to i wanna educate my team people that i work with to be like be equal you're working with women in your the office so you don't wanna have a different this a india member different type of uh thing for your wife and your partner in a different kind of situation for your work we have to like equalize that which is really important uh but yeah


like equalize that which is really important uh but yeah i'm happy to hear that you've heard good things about i've heard amazing things about you too uh what have you heard about me till this point i know that i mean actually to be very honest my team was like going nuts that we are doing this interview today they were like wow that is so cool and all i was like he's amazing all that does all these amazing podcasts but like i said this is this is a new world to me and thank you for introducing me to the world and i will i think that there is a lot here to explore and now i know that and good you also told me another thing is that the world of content creators do want or are interested to come into the other side to be honest sometimes it feels like they were so con content with their content that they are not interested they are making our money they look happy but if they are truly interested then i'm a great bridge between that and


interested then i'm a great bridge between that and i i'm looking for that and this looks thing that you were talking to me about it's actually not that important not in today's time we've moved forward and we're not keeping that as the only prerequisite of course in certain situations it matters but not in all um no i'm glad we could have yeah i bow down to the divine feminine inside you now pg thank you was welcome i'm so glad we did this it was great fun that was the episode for today sometimes i host some people on the show where i get to know them over the course of the episode and then i get to almost fanboy over them because i just love the person that i'm getting to know panchami khawari was one of those people where i just felt like being friends with this person even post the episode just felt a very deep connect i'm sure you all could sense it through the conversation but i can't guarantee you that she will be back on the show


you that she will be back on the show i want to know who else you'd like to see on this podcast of course we're bringing people from the world of bollywood but also keep in mind we've got episodes related spirituality the military geopolitics science all sorts of domains i want to know from you guys how we can take the podcast to the next level tell me guys keep supporting keep sharing and keep building with us trs will be back soon [Music] you


i've got six tattoos myself this podcast isn't about encouraging or discouraging you from getting tattoos i'm just gonna be sharing my stories things i've not spoken about on the internet till this point there's a deep meaning behind each of my tattoos but before i get to the story of each just want to give you some context about why i got tattoos myself my dad has about 15 tattoos i've seen him getting tattoos all my life and as a kid i thought you know i want to get my own version of that cut to my teenage was watching a lot of football a lot of mma fighting and i saw that many of the footballers and the fighters had tattoos some of the fighters went as far as saying that a lot of their strength is embedded within those tattoos and these are top level athletes who built up a certain kind of mentality while i was never good at sport i always perceived myself as an intellectual athlete of sorts and i


myself as an intellectual athlete of sorts and i felt like at the end of the day the mentality of being a physical athlete and an intellectual athlete is the same you've got to always want to get to that one level higher that's what i gained for my tattoos and this belief was locked in by dwayne the rock johnson who referenced his own polynesian tattoos and said that tattoos in polynesian culture and samoan culture are very spiritual they contain protection they contain strength they contain motivation that's been the core idea behind each of my tattoos i feel like i've reached a stage in my life where i won't ink up my body anymore because i've got a lot of ink on it already i've also been told by girls not to ink it up any further because it's too inked already deeply connected to each of them even today one thing i've learned about life in general especially when it comes to motivated mindsets is the concept of self-talk what do you do


is the concept of self-talk what do you do in that time that you spend alone most people are outwardly people they look outwards they look for motivation from content from web series from movies from music some people who are inward they meditate they think they're right they go within themselves they express their own creativity tattoos are a very very important part of your inward world if you have ink on your body you understand the importance of a tattoo when right after getting it you wake up the next day you look in the mirror and you see a drawing imagery a subject an idea on your own body and this idea is going to stay with you for the rest of your life most people either begin to hate a tattoo with time or they begin to love it even more every single day i believe i'm in that second category each of my tattoos gives me strength aids my spirituality and constitutes positive self-talk because of the meaning behind each of them it tells me a story about


each of them it tells me a story about where i came from where my life was at that moment that's what i'm sharing with you tattoo number one was got when i was 19. i was an alcoholic at that point of time i'd had my heart severely broken at that phase of my life flunked in exams for the first time in my life my life was a mess that was probably rock bottom of my life i remember the day i found out that i failed my mum found out and she didn't react badly she was honestly afraid for me she knew what a volatile aggressive guy i was she anticipated that i'd channelize all that aggression towards myself so like an appropriate 2011 urban indian mum with a very volatile son she said you know what whatever you want to do tomorrow just go do it i was numb with pain i was going through depression for sure i was in a very low state and i don't know what voice from within me made me tell her i


what voice from within me made me tell her i wanted to get him i went and got this phoenix tattoo that you guys see in all beer biceps videos uh it's become sort of iconic every time we go for meet and greets all over india there's always one or two kids who have this exact same tattoo and most people know what the story behind it is of all my tattoos that one's the most special because it was the first one and the significance of it at that point of time was to tell myself that listen this is rock bottom and everything from here onwards is upwards when you're going upwards in life it's not always a smooth curve there are moments where you do have these little dips but in the grand scheme of things when i've analyzed my own life's graph since the day i got that tattoo everything's been upwards this is what i mean by tattoos benefiting your own self-talk time you spend alone there's been low moments in my life as


alone there's been low moments in my life as recently as two months back and in those moments i look at this tattoo and it does give me strength most people may not agree with the concept of a tattoo being spiritual but spirituality in general your idea of self in general is such a subjective concept it's different for every human tattoos are the stories that you put on your own body to remind you of a certain mindset or a certain part of your own evolution and that's what this phoenix is for me it's a part of my story it's possibly the most important point in my own personal evolution seeing failure getting your heart broken going through depression going through the darkest possible mental state and then hoping that things will keep going up from there that's the story embedded in the phoenix moving on a tattoo number two was impulsive was quick was my second tattoo it was a flaming om what people know about my life is that i'm from a spiritual family what people


is that i'm from a spiritual family what people don't know is that there's roots to that spirituality within my family my dad belongs to an arya samarji family where havans are done often mysticism is spoken about often spirituality as a concept is spoken about often and the mystic nature the unknown nature of the sound um a um um is spoken about very often something beyond human understanding lots of people say do you even know what an om stands for the truth is that the more you read about the meaning of om the more mysterious it gets just like the nature of god what's god is it a man isn't a woman is it a sound in the universe is it something more symbolic is it something more tangible is it something beyond human understanding it's something so beyond human understanding that you can't call it something beyond human understanding you can't even use words to describe what it could possibly be like that's what an om stands for but in human words the symbol home especially in arya


but in human words the symbol home especially in arya samaji culture is the biggest representation of god always been a god-fearing person always believed deeply in god and i wanted that element of that childhood that element that had stayed constant throughout my life on my body that's the story behind the flaming om it's burning faith to remind me to keep my positivity alive to keep my faith alive through the worst of times phoenix had given me a lot of strength just by the way those papers i failed in i passed and eventually i went on to do really well in my engineering college days the om kind of just gave me positivity through that phase hope was in the bird positivity was in that home i held up on this whole tattoo game until my fourth year of engineering college now at this phase um again with college in general in india you've got to understand your first impression is your last impression so in my first year of college uh i had that impression of being sort of an


uh i had that impression of being sort of an alcoholic a party boy who didn't study who stopped studying rather and the teachers knew that the students knew that so that reputation stuck around with me through the rest of college most of the senior staff in college knew about that to add to that whole vibe i was also a power lifter and i became extremely buff so i had a reputation of being a bad boy in college i was a great dude but i had a reputation of being a bad boy i ended up getting this internship right before my final year began it was an internship with a fitness company where 300 people from my college had tried for it and they selected only three of those people i was one of those three and i was pumped because i wasn't motivated by the academics of college i was motivated by everything else especially something related to fitness so here's college scenarios right if you want to lock an internship for yourself but you've gained through college you


for yourself but you've gained through college you have to go to your placement officer the placement officer in my college degree was very notorious for being strict notorious for really uh being tough on his students and that's exactly what he did with me so i was this buff dude who cracked that internship three out of 300 people were selected the other two people were very good at their studies i was still getting there i was on my way up i went inside that room and he looked at me in front of staff students and said hey aren't you that same kid who failed what's your aggregate now by the way oh okay i don't think you're built for this internship so i gave him my aggregate which wasn't out of the world it was pretty mediocre so he looks at me and says you know what i'm canceling your internship you're not gonna get it and you can go do what you want first go and study that's what's sad about indian colleges there's too much bitterness


about indian colleges there's too much bitterness from people's own pasts that they kind of project on to students but that's all right now eventually i ended up working with that same company i went to them and said that my college placement officer didn't really let me take the internship and they told me yeah whatever don't worry we'll give it to you anyway so i got the internship but on the day that this incident took place i was sad man i had finished three years of engineering college where i was just not in a good mind state i didn't like teachers projecting their own insecurities and bitterness onto me i didn't like the students kind of attacking me along with the teachers i had a really really tough time in engineering college the good thing i've done for myself is that i've done a lot of internships myself had made my own money even in engineering college it was a little bit but it was enough to make a tattoo that night i slept with a lot


tattoo that night i slept with a lot of sadness and i remember this very vividly i got a dream of being in a field with a lot of pigeons just hordes and hordes of pigeons and at one point in the dream they kind of just separated out and kind of created a pathway for me to walk on so i walked on that pathway and at the end of the pathway there was this white dove and something in my head within that dream told me to pick up that dove so i picked it up and it turned into shankar bhagavan shivji i wasn't a religious kid i was spiritual i had some spiritual understanding but this is way before i started meditating this is way before i started reading about spiritual books this is way before i started respecting religion again so it was a very random dream for me but i vividly remember him telling me that you know things are going to be good just have hope i woke up the next day i just


have hope i woke up the next day i just felt like my brain had had a shower i felt hope i felt positivity and this stayed with me for a while that following mahashivratri i was thinking about shankar bhagavan a lot i was thinking about shivji a lot for some reason i had some money saved and i went and got the tattoo that's on my back which is a tattoo of shiva and his hair instead of turning into the ganga as the legend says it turns into white doves for me that tattoo contains a lot of peace i had a lot of anger in my heart at that point towards that placement officer towards the faculty towards the students 99 of the students in my college made fun of me for failing in the first year always made jibes always kind of looked down upon me too sometimes suck up to the teachers it was a harsh environment for a young adult and i feel like at that phase of my life i needed to let go of the


of my life i needed to let go of the anger a little bit and that's what's embedded within that tattoo so reminder to have hope and not get angry in life after this i graduate with the first class just by the way i studied so hard after failing that i brought my aggregate up from 48 percent to being eligible for first class which is a little higher than 60 which doesn't seem like a lot but in engineering college it's good enough and i think my life has turned out fine so you know what aggregates don't even matter in the long term but at that stage that 60 mark meant a lot right after college most of you know i tried working in an engineering based company i tried doing a bunch of random jobs eventually tried launching a fitness startup someone recommended that i market the startup on social media therefore i started beer biceps and then biceps just started growing organically so from 2015 august to about june of 2016 i worked alone june july is where


of 2016 i worked alone june july is where rajas joined but that phase from august 2015 to june 2016 was also a very intense time for my life it contained a lot of people pointing fingers doubting me a lot of self-doubt a lot of battling my own relatives a lot of going that extra mile to work hard to go gain what you really wish to gain in life it required a lot of personal battles it required a lot of tears which were shed behind closed doors very stressful phase of my life and i don't know whether this is the worst part or the best part but i did all of it alone no one helped me battling my own anger battling my own self doubt battling my own sadness alone not a positive face but a phase that [ __ ] battle hardened me i feel like i came out of warrior and if i could go through that phase of my life which i might speak about in a solo podcast at some point


speak about in a solo podcast at some point but if i went through that phase of my life i could go through anything in my life i was a first-class engineering graduate who didn't apply for higher studies who didn't apply for jobs and who just went and trained people at the house to make money so i made ends meet i could pay for my own equipment on beer biceps but it was a jugaad battle hardening phase of my life i set a personal target of 10 000 subscribers which at that point was bigger than you can imagine 10 000 subscribers in 2015-16 was before the jio revolution came into play it's the equivalent of about 150 to 200k subscribers in today's day and age and it took that long took me a lot of grind a lot of hard work i came up the hard way didn't make shady content didn't make clickbaity content just put out information worked hard learnt about this industry cried a lot at 10 000 subscribers i wanted to remind myself of what


000 subscribers i wanted to remind myself of what that journey was like and therefore got that tiger with the crown on its head lions are fantastic but lions are all about their own pride tigers work alone tigers fight alone and if you've gone through that journey of being a tiger you can eventually become a lion doesn't work the other way around a lion once is a lion forever a tiger can morph into anything and that's what's in that tattoo if you look at the tattoo closely the tiger also has scars the scars are the most important element of that tattoo the crown that we've drawn on it is very rough it's to symbolize the ruggedness of that journey wasn't easy when i used to go to train people i even got molested in the train twice or thrice and i had to like push people off fight with people done lots of [ __ ] in that phase man [ __ ] i've not spoken about on the internet until now


i've not spoken about on the internet until now there's toughness in that tattoo i just joined my life team started building up things started becoming better happier more social the tiger turned into a lion at this phase of my life the lion needed a lioness [Music] and that's what i was hoping and praying for i'm never that guy who says that you should get someone else's name tattooed or you know something that symbolizes another person but after i turned into that line there were two things i was thinking of very distinctively the first was that i needed a partner in my life the second was my reinstated faith in god i used to still think of that shankar bhagavan dream i used to think about my ayahuasca experience that i'd had so getting more and more spiritual in life i started reading verses from the bible i started watching a lot of ufc again a very famous ufc fighter called jon jones had this bible verse tattooed on his shoulder said


this bible verse tattooed on his shoulder said philippians 4 13. i can do all things through he who gives me strength that thought means that anything you do in your life whether you become a lion tiger elephant shark all that is the universe acting through you it's not just you once i became the tiger on the line i also saw arrogance rising within me i did this it was all me me alone all me i think that latching on to spirituality in that phase of my life was a way to cope with that arrogance so when that someone special finally came into my life she was a very positive effect on me at that point i just felt like to symbolize that moment of like being aware of your own arrogance being aware of your own anger also being aware of your own faith and where you want to go in life all that's encapsulated in my philippians 4 13 tattoo just like jon jones and just like a lot of other athletes who have the same


like a lot of other athletes who have the same tattoo philippians 4 13 i can do all things through him who gives me strength it's my favorite verse from the bible it's one of my favorite spiritual quotes in the world this was the second last tattoo because the last tattoo was i feel the final piece of the puzzle for me i got the last tattoo right before we signed our deal to move into the prabhadevi office so for those of you who don't really follow beer bicycle don't know the startup journey beyo biceps began we grew we uh created a lot of videos we needed help with our management our backend therefore i was forced to create an agency a media startup which people know today as monk entertainment very difficult story by itself there's a lot of struggles involved there as well just as is the case with all startups but after working for two years continuously out of a garage we had enough money to get our own office to pay rent


enough money to get our own office to pay rent to house more than just eight or nine people we were at an expansion stage in our lives so i remember being with my co-founders rajas and viraj and going to sign that agreement and i got reflective i asked myself that okay it's been three to four years of this journey what's gotten us to this point three to four years is a short time honestly in the long term scheme of things three to four years is lesser than how long engineering college was so it was rapid growth in a short time when i really really asked my mind the same question the answer i got was focus we even made a motivational video about the concept of focus because it was a factor that i was thinking about a lot at that point in my life focusing putting your consciousness on growth putting your consciousness on the growth of the ones around you putting your consciousness on where you wish to be a year from now if i want to be a tech


year from now if i want to be a tech entrepreneur today i've got to perceive myself as a tech entrepreneur i've got to learn about tech i've got to put all my focus on tech that final tattoo is a bow and arrow to remind me about focus the factor that's driven all the other factors in my life yes i say that the phoenix helped with hope the om helped with positivity the shivji helped with calm the tiger had good toughness the philippians 4 13 helped with humility the bow and arrow always helps with the basis of all these other possibilities if you have no focus in your life none of the other stuff matters the bow and arrow of course also represents arjun from mahabharata the most iconic mahabharata character the one that's taught me the most about life and after i got that tattoo i just felt like it's enough the story has been written enough while i say that i may not get any more ink i don't know i


may not get any more ink i don't know i might change my mind going forward but that's the story of my tattoos they all constitute the positive self-talk they all constitute to making me a slightly better version of myself they all have different messages they all give me different forms of strength a lot of people might laugh at this but your reality your version of motivation your version of yourself is what you create it's not for people to decide it's for you to decide some people go to books and music some people go to meditation some people go to hobbies in the most difficult years of my life my tattoos gave me strength they gave me fire and they gave me that upward trajectory that i needed in those phases i hope you've gained something from this video i hope this podcast stays with you and i hope that you're also going on your own upward trajectory thank you guys [Music] so [Music] you


now this is the episode that will talk about the future of technology with a focus on blockchain technology web 3 and all the possible business opportunities and tech opportunities of the near future highly recommend you watch this particular episode you consume this particular episode with a notebook because this was one of the heaviest episodes we've created in the history of the randby show we've gotten into the deep core basics of what blockchain technology even means we've got into the significance and actual technology behind the ethereum network behind bitcoin behind all other future technologies which are around the corner of course we address the metals so much was spoken about on this episode of the ranvi show with a very special soul with a very special mind saket modi who returns on the show once again we did a super hit episode about cyber security and ethical hacking in the past i suggest that you go consume that episode if you haven't already but if you're someone who's just here for the web 3 specifics if you're just here


for the web 3 specifics if you're just here to learn more about blockchain then enjoy this particular episode this one's extremely detailed try keeping up with the heaviness of this conversation but i promise you this will be one of the best technology episodes of any podcast that you'll ever consume that's the power of saketh modi and for now i'll let you enjoy this very heavy but beautiful episode of the ranveer show [Music] the last time you were here we did a blockbuster episode and i feel like we just scratched the surface on that one because it was just about cyber security but in your heart you're a hacker in your heart you understand technology very deeply according to me in fact on this show you're one of the deepest technological minds that we've had so welcome back you're very kind and weird you're one of the deepest minds that i've met so i'm glad coming so so yeah i mean you know you have a much wider i would say universe to cover


a much wider i would say universe to cover and uh you're doing a great job thank you for having me back oh yeah sure you're one of my uh goal posts in terms of learning like when you're here it's gonna be like a sort of technological tuition for me that's how i look at it i feel like a tutor already you'd go ahead dude so one thing i've noticed with web3 folks crypto folks nft foxes i love all the ideas i love how passionate they are about it i love how motivated they are about it but obviously like as my friend nikhil karma put it they kind of glass half full kind of people where it's sometimes a little too optimistic um and and similarly like you know there's a lot of old-school people primarily from the finance world because we're talking so much about cryptocurrencies nowadays uh maybe from the web to world as well which is very hesitant about web three metals crypto all these things i feel you're the kind of good neutral


these things i feel you're the kind of good neutral perspective on this because you're somewhere in the middle of it all so uh what's your take what excites you about our future when it comes to technology wow so i think i can just go on for six hours only for one question that you just actually go you dropped meta words you talked crypto you spoke about blockchains you spoke about nfts and there's just so much for each one of these types of technology if you can call that as but uh but but let me just start at the concept level of what you said right in my view when people ask me that look what do you think what's the future etc etc i like that line which says nothing can stop an idea whose time has come and that's blockchain for you crypto is an application of blockchain web 3.0 is an application of the blockchain technology now there are various ways of achieving what blockchain does why uh you know different ways but blockchain is the most popular way so the


ways but blockchain is the most popular way so the future and i'm not saying everything in the world will be on blockchain no no i'm not saying that right but i'm saying that a lot of what we will do in the near future not very distant would definitely be powered by blockchain because it's fundamentally a different way of looking at things it's almost like you know it's like when writing was invented like socrates freaked out his story and and and and you know there were all sorts of funny things when the engine was invented it was like oh it'll blast off and you know uh it'll cause more deaths than when car was invented oh there will be more road accidents and therefore it's better uh henry ford had that very very famous saying that if i asked people of what do you want to commute faster between two places they would ask for faster horses and not the car you know which used to which use the engine and i would say uh blockchain as


use the engine and i would say uh blockchain as a technology is exactly that runway i would say it's a fundamentally different way of how you look at peer-to-peer connectivity how you look at communication happening and there are two key elements of blockchain runway which is out there one it is distributed second it has a shared memory it's really that simple you have to go to the basics also like i mean while a lot of the listeners know what blockchain is there's a lot who don't so you have to go to the abc's sure let's start from the abc they show them the b of blockchain and let's take a step back and let's divide the word blockchain into two blocks which are put into a chain is called a blockchain really that simple what does that mean it simply means that whenever you're doing a series of i don't want to call it transaction i want to call it just actions action is actually a better word right when you're doing a series of actions which one follows the


doing a series of actions which one follows the other follows the other follows the other and technically think about it everything you do from the morning it's a series of actions that you're doing today which is after a series of actions you did yesterday etc that can be a transaction also by the way if you actually think about you know 10 years back look at your bank account right you can actually track which day how much money you got which day how much money you spent and that's a series of transactions which are out there and put that together now that's crypto now of course on on the internet right when you go to facebook.com for the first time starting from creating your account till putting your information on the account till actually liking commenting can i say it's a series of actions that you're taking which can actually be you know linearly stored in a very normal white paper i can just write a you know normal paper excel sheet i say hey number one number two number three number four number five now


one number two number three number four number five now that's first which i want to start with saying that because we all live in a time series right it's literally t equals zero when you're born and you're moving forward from there you can capture everything that you do in a linear fashion now when that happens and you capture every single aspect of a particular type of action the more popular one being bitcoins right cryptocurrencies when you capture all transactions one by one in a block so you imagine one block and i'm simplifying i'm like super dumping it down here so that that's how i understood like long back when i was studying blockchains right if you if you just put like there are just two people you and me in the world and in total there are 100 rupees can i say that 100 rupee which is there the sum total of what you and i will have first has to be hundred rupees secondly no matter how much transactions we do the sum total will always remain hundred rupees


do the sum total will always remain hundred rupees and who has how much money at what time can be determined with two things one how much money in the beginning did you and i have suppose you had 70 rupees and i had 30 rupees so it starts from t equals 0 from the beginning of time this is my how much money you had this is how much money i have and every time we have transacted if we put that in a very simple excel sheet or every time runway you give me five rupees i give you 10 rupees you give me 20 rupees you give me 30 rupees and you're left with now 40 rupees and i have 60 rupees right suppose that is the transaction can i say it is very simple to maintain history just by seeing the transactions what happens in a cryptocurrency when they use blockchain instead of two people there are millions of people which are transacting instead of saying that there are 100 rupees because the currency value is fluctuating but the number of


the currency value is fluctuating but the number of blockchains or not sorry the number of bitcoins in the case by the way the answer is different for every type of cryptocurrency so the total number of bitcoins was finitely capped to a particular number 21 million at some point that's some somewhere around that so it was already defined of the total number of bitcoins that can ever exist and then you had to do something called proof of work and we can get into that if you want to mine those currencies in other words that's why i said it always starts by saying how much do you have what is the total sum 100 rupees and in that you had 70 and i had 30 to start with so it starts as the first block saying this is how much money this person has and that's who you are and from there every transaction is captured in a particular block so today when you do a transaction on a bitcoin it basically says this bitcoin wallet it basically is private keys of the way encryption works


it basically is private keys of the way encryption works there so uh this bitcoin valve the private key is signed using the public key so your actual identity is the public key which is actually a cryptographic key using which you're sending the money to a particular cryptographic key the way in whatsapp your phone number is your identity in the world of bitcoins your public key is your identity what if you're sending point zero zero one two like someone does the blockchain become smaller or something no so i'm saying the blockchain will only keep becoming bigger and bigger because blockchain doesn't care about the value of transaction okay the entry that you're doing whether you do it for one million dollars or one million blockchains ah sorry one million bitcoins or you do it for point zero zero zero zero zero one bitcoin it doesn't matter it's an entry um so okay i i'm asking this from a visualization perspective when we say something is based on blockchain technology you're definitely not talking about just one chain of blocks right


not talking about just one chain of blocks right i'm talking about one chain only one generator one chain of blocks okay i'm talking about each block and that's the reason i'm saying every time there's a transaction anywhere in the world got it the block has to become bigger it doesn't matter what the transaction is and ranveer what happens is this entire block because remember these are text strings right text characters right let to simplify that so this will be a you know there's be a few mb files which would be out there that entire block is stored at thousands of computers so that becomes the blockchain and that's why it's called blockchain because every one every block will have list of transactions and every block is connected to the next block using the previous blocks hash value and therefore if you change anything in a very old block even in the previous block you have to change every block moving forward and this actually happened by the way has it ever happened that blockchain uh some blockchain technology


ever happened that blockchain uh some blockchain technology has changed transactions from the past can you change it the answer is yes you can but then majority of the key stakeholders have to agree saying okay there was a screw-up we did say six months back and we want to change that this is a good example of ethereum where there was this huge exchange which actually got hacked and there was millions of dollars which basically got disappeared and they they were transferred so a lot of people in fact majority of the ethereum community came together to say nope that's not right because there's so many people impacted i want to go to the point of reversing the transaction and please keep this in mind a person cannot do it it has to be the entire community and even in that runway while most people said we should do it there was still a small minority of people saying no we should not do it i mean this was people and their conscious decision of transferring money there and they got hacked and


of transferring money there and they got hacked and hacks happen and and that's fine so what happened was there were two different types of ethereum which was born therefore it's ethereum classic and then there's the other ethereum which is out there so you can change the thing but it needs thousands of people how do they make a decision like they have come together at some conference or like what what is it chat forums of course chat so there are various chat forums which are out there there are uh you know there's so many ways of communication if somebody wants to just keep listening in what's going on there irc channels uh which are out there and uh we spoke about deep and dark web there are a lot of forums which are dedicated for the discussions of individual types of crypto and there are a lot of you know again the flavors of cryptos which are out there and uh and there is a bunch of people and this is the reason why a lot of people think oh crypto means completely


why a lot of people think oh crypto means completely decentralized no it's not completely decentralized it's just that there is not one company which is making money out of it which controls it but there's still a bunch of people who control uh the first principles of how the blockchain that particular blockchain is supposed to operate and behave so uh again going back to the visualization where you said that bitcoin as a currency has one chain which attaches a series of blocks to each other and every time anyone transacts in bitcoin it's more to it yeah any in the world so someone brazil could be doing it this second someone in pakistan could be doing it this second correct and things have been added on the blockchain and blockchain has a problem of number of transactions per second okay the reason i added that complexity that's the reason why when you want to do a transaction on say bitcoins for example bitcoins can only take up to and it depends you know x number of transactions per second so in other words


x number of transactions per second so in other words if you right now want to make a transaction on bitcoin you can't immediately make it because there's a limit because remember every block goes to the network and says you have to tell me if i'm a valid transaction so so bitcoin you know will be a few transactions a second ethereum now goes up to like 13 14 15 transactions per second uh and and that's just where we are that's a technological uh i would say challenge and that's the reason why scaling it up to crazy ways where you know if you say oh i'm gonna have the bitcoin wallet on my phone where i will pay for every coffee and i will pay for every uh thing it doesn't happen you can fast forward the transaction by paying more but then your transaction fees will go up so basically every time you want to exchange money for bitcoin on a crypto exchange you're entering a sort of queue an international queue yes and then when you're ready whatever you can exchange your money so it


you're ready whatever you can exchange your money so it can either be you exchange it for very little transaction fee but it'll take much longer or you can pay more it's like a vip service right so you take that and then you actually get ahead of the queue because uh and that's how you will be able to you know transact faster so that was one question i had the other question is you know how you said that okay bitcoin is governed by one chain which has blocks linked to each other similarly ethereum is running on a separate chain with its own blocks similarly whenever we say that okay this is a blockchain based technology it has its own chain with different blocks yes that's the logic absolutely okay so blockchain essentially means that you're absolutely right in first principles you always have blocks which are connecting to each other and there is a history so again i said there are two things which define the concept of blockchain one it is it is distributed the second it has shared memory so so something which


the second it has shared memory so so something which is computing at not one like the transaction validation of a particular crypto will not happen in one system on one server that happens today in a bank right so the bank goes okay do you have this bank balance yes you do i approve of it and you're able to go ahead and do the transaction immediately that's one server so one it's very very distributed where there'll be thousands of systems again thousand depends on what crypto you're talking about but there'll be a lot of nodes which will be computing exactly the same thing you know and saying is that a valid transaction or not and if majority of the nodes which are there in the network and you also build a reputation of the node depending on the number of years the number of you know currency that you mind etc etc so there's a full algorithm for that also and once most of the chain says that yes this is a trustable valid transaction that is where it becomes formally a part of


that is where it becomes formally a part of the blockchain and the new blockchain is then broadcasted in the whole network uh saying you know this is where it is most uh most of the nodes already have that because they were the ones who validated also uh but and if there is any anomaly so i'm trying to send you hundred dollars by only i only have 50 in my wallet so it will flag that as an anomaly and that will not become a part of the blockchain which is out there so blockchain is a technology you're absolutely right it's blocks with transactions which are shared with each other and they share a common memory because that's a common memory between everybody which is out there so that it becomes theoretically decentralized so it is definitely decentralized yes um okay now i gotta again go back to the basics so all the softwares we use on our phone right now instagram twitter whatever used uh i mean a built using web 2 protocols which basically means coding languages of this kind


2 protocols which basically means coding languages of this kind of kind a of type a okay say or java c plus plus etc now this is a whole new world where coders have to learn about blockchain technology and use blockchain protocols which you can understand to be sort of new age coding languages to be able to build web3 products is it correct at this point so a slight difference ranveer when you talk about coding languages you use the same coding languages in web 3.0 also so you use javascript you use a lot of that stuff the fundamental difference comes in on how do you store and process the data because you don't have a you know big deal in terms of using the front-end language the challenge happens when you store the data and process the data in a centralized versus a decentralized fashion again i gotta dial back a little bit and again i'm dialing back because front end uh coding and background coding is things that i learned only last year when i was working on level so for


last year when i was working on level so for amateurs front end is basically what you see on your phone uh your ui you know like how does a face user interface oh yeah sorry see i'm learning from you and we love it your user interface where basically how does a button look how does a button feel how many buttons are the design of the app um your back end is what is the actual company seeing it kind of is like a front end and back end of a business so you know kinara the khan your front end is you see the eggs you see the masalas whatever you see the lace packets etc and the back end is all the stuff that the shopkeeper knows the accounting books uh where he stores the eggs before he keeps everybody stores the layers before he keeps it out so let's double click on both web 2.0 and web 3.0 and the fundamental difference between that right you can use a lot of similar technology that you use in web 2.0 into three web


that you use in web 2.0 into three web 3.0 runway that's not a problem the difference lies on how do you store and how do you process that data today when you go to facebook.com for the first time you create an email account or you create an account using your email you're creating that particular account on the servers in the database of facebook and then you use that data uh to go ahead and log in the next time you come in and once you're inside that's the unique identifier of yours which is your email which can be a profile id also everything that you do is tracked and stored within facebook's databases what happens in web 3.0 as a good example is you will be able to go ahead and create and store that data in a particular social media platform but it won't be stored with the consensus of or with the authority of the owner of the social media in other words it will be stored in a server in an encrypted fashion where whoever is running that website will not have


where whoever is running that website will not have a direct access to the unencrypted form of that data and then even when you process the data because today web 3.0 provides you that you know that flexibility where you can process at multiple nodes so you don't have to worry about the fact that whatever data you're giving is being processed at the same server which means the data correlation of getting to know the patterns of what you're doing what you're clicking on what you're seeing what you're texting etc etc all of that correlation while it's being processed you don't have to you know worry about the fact that that is all adding up every time you type something and because of that tracking you and we spoke about that the fundamental quality of being a human being is the fact that you can think independently without worrying that somebody has eyes on you and watching you constantly because that actually takes away your first principle ability of being human because you suddenly start feeling like oh my god am i


suddenly start feeling like oh my god am i being watched and then the way you think changes so the point i'm making is that's web 3.0 for you where the data will become decentralized and it will be stored at not one but multiple places by the way but because it's stored in multiple places it'll be encrypted and most of the platforms that i have seen will actually go ahead and even the bosses of the platform so don't take me wrong there will still be you know a small team of 10 20 30 people who will run the platform and can be even bigger but they will not have an access to your data and you will be able to still operate similar functionalities if not all uh in in such a platform i have to ask you the burning question which is about ethereum when we say something is built on the ethereum network what does that even mean it simply means that ethereum provides let's take a step back what is bitcoin because it becomes a good comparison to have bitcoin has been


it becomes a good comparison to have bitcoin has been coded in a way where the only transactions that you can store on a block remember we spoke about blockchain so every block has transactions but the limitation of transactions is it can only transact bitcoins and the program which is used to write those transactions in every block is something called a turing incomplete programming language what that means is in a very simple way if i were to give an analogy think about the brain of a dog versus the brain of a human can i say the brain of humans in most cases not all but in most cases do far more transactions can do far more things than the brain of a dog in most cases definitely the case right that's the reason why humans are able to think outside of the box and and obviously you know we've been able to build what we've been able to build as a human society so a programming language which is turing incomplete is a dumbed down programming language where you can do very limited number of transactions


language where you can do very limited number of transactions so you can only say oh the money went from this wallet to that wallet but what ethereum did it uses the same principle of blockchain but the programming language in that is a turing complete programming language what that means is ranveer you can do far more transactions so you are no longer just saying that i will store the transaction as only monetary bitcoin wallet to bitcoin wallet transaction now you can make a block which says the moment your instagram id is made it will be an entry on the block the moment you like a picture it will be an entry on the block the moment you comment on a picture it becomes an entry on the block so the principle of blockchain remains as i said we all live in you know linear time series right and therefore it is easy to create a block of all the actions and not just financial transactions so what ethereum allowed developers to do is to give a programming language where you can create programs on the blockchain technology and that


you can create programs on the blockchain technology and that program can be anything it can be calling your uber it can be ordering a pizza it can be going ahead and storing all the land records which are out there because again land records think about it right the land will start from somebody's ownership will go to somebody and then go to somebody and then go to somebody these can all be transactions why not just use the old school languages to build this 100 you can absolutely do it the fundamental problem of old school languages is today uber knows exactly how many times you take a cab from where you start to where you go what are the places you are visiting at what times if you think about it again i'm trying to say and people don't realize this that and a lot of people are like oh what do i have to worry because i don't have anything to hide no i would go to the point of saying the future is where based on the behavior of people you can predict how will they


the behavior of people you can predict how will they react in a particular situation i'll give you a small example if a mobile app which is uh you know let's take an example of something which uh you call it cab from do you know this if it hasn't permission to listen to your microphone it can listen to you anytime it wants it doesn't need to ask you imagine if i am the maker of the app and i'm listening that every time i see ranveer shouting getting very mad or if i don't want to be hearing it also i see every time you throw your phone because you know a lot of people when they get angry they throw the phone wherever you know the moment you throw the phone i don't even need any permission based on just these sensors within the phone which is the accelerometer and the gyroscope etc etc i can figure out that somebody's just thrown this phone every time you throw the phone between 6 to 7 pm you end up at a bar at 8 pm


pm you end up at a bar at 8 pm and i know that's the obvious place that you will always go every time i've spoken a word it triggers some part of your brain and you will become mad at it do you know you become like a puppet in my hand because i know exactly how you will respond so i can put you into situations by sending you a particular type of communication to make you vote for me to make you behave in a particular way to make you hate a certain group of people absolutely anything so not only hate even fall in love so you get this fanatic group of people who are oh i'm in love with this particular person i'm in love with this particular group so that particular way of thinking it's almost like you know you're coloring the eyes of the person to only see a particular thing and i can do that quite easily the moment i have more data about you so again the logic of building software using ethereum protocols is anonymity


logic of building software using ethereum protocols is anonymity yes like that's the core law that's the core of web 3.0 and that's much bigger than what people realize because human behaviors mindsets happiness is getting affected by like web 2 100 and here's the point right because it becomes predictable of what you're doing to manipulate you becomes the easiest thing and it's not just about you clicking on ads that's one of the smaller problems right i mean that's not the big deal the bigger deal becomes when you're making i mean you can choose a president who would not be in the best interest of the country but there was a different country would run a propaganda by the way this is a live documentary it was actually a great ted talk which actually showed systematically during brexit communities of people who were systematically given a particular type of information to say oh europe is very very bad for the uk and therefore i need to go ahead and come out of that because it's so


go ahead and come out of that because it's so bad for our economy while the truth was exactly the opposite so you're talking about changing the course of history as we move into the future because of just being able to track human beings and do that at scale not at an individual level [Music] so again i want to ask you from a visualization perspective ethereum is a blockchain one chain lots of blocks data stored on it yeah when we say when we say something is built on ethereum yeah or on the ethereum network what's the visualization of it so i would say don't say uh ethereum is a blockchain i would say if he think of ethereum more like uh a framework which allows developer to build something on top of it what does a framework mean framework basically means uh the framework of the shoot we are doing right now is microphones and cameras and lighting in the background tools tools but you can do whatever content you want with this so you want to do something on cyber security you want to do something


do something on cyber security you want to do something on personal wellness that's on you the framework becomes basically the foundation on how will you do it guess what every podcast of yours will have the same mic right it will have the same quality of voice on how you're processing it because the framework is the same but what you build on top of it is completely your call that's exactly how you look at ethereum although there's also an application of ethereum as the ethereum coin yeah but that was just one of the applications there are thousand things more that you can do with the ethereum uh framework which is out there so when people think of ethereum usually they think of the coin that you see on the ground very small use of criterion so ethereum is actually sort of tools which you can use to build softwares framework is a better word yeah framework to build softwares yeah to build softwares based on web 3.0 technology and um in order to use those softwares you need to buy into the framework using ethereum coins


you need to buy into the framework using ethereum coins yeah eth so ethereum coins if you want to use certain tools you want to incentivize people like think about it right why will somebody store data of your users if you are building a social network on web 3.0 why will i do it right and the reason you do it is because i am giving you an incentivizing you to make me use your processing power and the moment i use your processing power your processor if you have a server or a laptop you say okay you know what give me x amount of compute power i will give you this much uh ethereum coin which is it or i can even give you bitcoins that's not a problem so i will incentivize you is is what it comes down to and just on those lines something very unusual that most people would not know about you know the whole concept of cloud computing and most large companies are going into cloud something very interesting there ranveer and most large companies are right now going to the


and most large companies are right now going to the cloud whether it's aws azure or gcp uh it's a very interesting report by google cloud last year which says more than 80 percent of hacks on the cloud happen to either mine cryptocurrencies or won or run uh web 3.0 applications so imagine what's happening hackers are hacking into cloud computing or computers on laptops and mobile phones not to hack the pictures or extort money that's too small and you know at the same time it has too much hassle right you're personally offending somebody and there can be consequences blah blah blah the better thing is i will hack into your computer and the moment i've hacked into your computer i will use your processing power to make your computer a node in the web 3.0 circuit and i will start hosting content which is encrypted but because i'm hosting it guess what i'm making money out of it basically like stealing electricity from power lines yeah exactly like that right so you're stealing electricity in


like that right so you're stealing electricity in this case also you're stealing compute which is powered by electricity so absolutely the real world question is how is there so much real world money dollars and rupees backing these kind of technologies one i know all the crypto exchanges have raised money uh there's definitely an element at least of hype that oh cryptocurrencies are the new hot thing it is the future of the internet there is kind of real world backing behind that hype okay but why do people say that oh like the biggest money making opportunities of the future especially from a startup investment perspective are web 3 based products is it because it's where the world is moving why why is there so much money in that ecosystem sure so in order to understand that ranvier if we just take a step back and think about it first of all what makes bitcoin or ethereum or any of the you know cryptocurrencies worth anything right i mean one bitcoin is worth x thousand dollars what makes it worth so


worth x thousand dollars what makes it worth so right so let's understand that because the moment that's the first principle right and from there we'll understand the ecosystem of what is the worth of all cryptocurrencies and where it's going and how do you make money out of it so you know as humans there is this concept that is deeply embedded in our head have you i'm pretty sure you've heard that right son if you have to be rich you have to be very hardworking right we're all told that forever right you work very hard and then you will make money it's a very simple principle it's a philosophy what we say no no keep going keep in mind so it's okay all right okay now i thought uh you know the hack starts now they're coming for you but here's the point so um so if you think about it what makes bitcoin worth anything and the theory is called the theory of work it's very absurd if you think about it ranveer but i'll give i like


think about it ranveer but i'll give i like giving this good example uh that imagine that you are at a toll booth it's a warm sunny day and you're very thirsty in your car you have somebody standing next to you who has a mineral water bottle of water and you say how much does it cost the person says 50 rupees like 50 rupees supposed to be 20 rupees that's cmrp why are you charging me more said hi it's it's here if you want to take it that's fine if you don't want to take it that's fine that's scenario a take scenario b where again you're at the same toll booth where the car is standing very hot very hot and very uh very sunny and basically there's somebody who's standing who does not have a bottle of water and the person says you're asking but do you know somebody who can get me a bottle of water he said sir of course i can do it you know you can do it can you just


it you know you can do it can you just quickly go and grab a bottle of water and i'll pay you the money then i'll do it right away and the person runs to the shop gets a bottle of water and comes and gives it to you and this time the person says i'll charge you 50 rupees in situation a and situation b which situation will you be more comfortable in paying 50 rupees it has to be situation b because you just saw the person do work in front of you and the way our brain is trained say oh he's doing some extra work and therefore the person deserves a little bit of more money because the person did some work if you think about it while you saw the work happen in front of you and therefore you thought that was worth whatever money and you paid a little bit more money it is actually more inefficient than the first one because the person took more time to run go grab the stuff and come back while in the first case because


stuff and come back while in the first case because you did not see the work happening the worth of that bottle was a bottle why are you trying to charge me something more it's just how we are wired to think this is exactly how bitcoins operate also bitcoins or any cryptocurrency today are solving absurdly stupid but very complex mathematical problems do you know what do you do when there is a three-year-old or a four-year-old that you have to make them busy you give them a puzzle which can never be solved right they're so busy doing that they're working they're thinking i'm doing something of relevance in reality it's it's it's stupid right it's just that's fine they're just having fun or you know whatever you'll be surprised every single cryptocurrency that is mined especially the more popular ones are simply solving super complex mathematical puzzles which mean nothing if all the bitcoins will be mined it's not that we would have solved world hunger or we would have a solution


solved world hunger or we would have a solution for hiv or nothing then by the way all of that also needs a lot of computation but it's basically that you're proving that you're working by solving some stupid equations and that is the reason why you are worth a particular bitcoin that you get after you've solved it and how do you solve it by doing more processing and more processing and more processing so that's the linkage of the theory of work and what makes or what gives you one bitcoin what gives you two bitcoins or point zero one bitcoin whatever that is now coming to your question how do you make money out of it is that a hype it's 100 a hype right when i say 100 means i'm not saying that there's no value in the blockchain technology i'm the one who said this in the beginning that nothing can stop an idea whose time has come as technology as first principles i think it will it will definitely change the world but will bitcoin be the way


definitely change the world but will bitcoin be the way by which that's the only way by which the world will change or cryptocurrencies or eliminating banks would be the way well it'll be a part of it but it doesn't look like that that's the only way because the fundamental premise on which any currency any fiat currency of any country is based and again that's a little murky water where i'm going into but it it was always supposed to be natural resources the gold reserves that you have basically what is the net worth of your country is what was converted into fiat currencies and i'm simplifying this out here and that is what could be the total worth of a country now there are some big countries which took that away and started printing uh more money than what it was for multiple reasons they had debt they they could people who owed them money and there were various crazy calculations that came into the picture but the more important aspect was that at least there was some base that if a country


at least there was some base that if a country is worth five trillion dollars there was a base on why it is five trillion dollars and you know it keeps going up and coming down depending on the trade and you know fluctuation of the currency and and other things which are out there but in the case of most crypto currencies the fundamental premise that okay there's so much gold reserve that this group has that the you know the masters of bitcoin have and therefore the total worth of bitcoin will always be there is not there and it's this herd immunity or herd mentality which is out there uh where everybody is buying because everybody's buying but almost nobody knows why they somebody's buying and and the worst thing is nobody or most people don't understand how it really works at a first principle level and that becomes a bigger problem how do you see like facebook turning its name to meta kind of being a part of this because i've actually spoken to some people from the


this because i've actually spoken to some people from the nfd space we had someone on the show anchor rustagi and he isn't too optimistic about facebook or transitioning into the metaphors he thinks that basically they lack agility because those systems that are built out are very web 2 centric do you agree with that so metaverse is not all web 3.0 right and also a key question of course right i mean of course metaverse is not all web 3.0 and there's a lot of stuff that you would basically have which are aspects of using web 2.0 and web 3.0 i'm just saying it's inclusive and as i said in the beginning and you said that also because the definition of metaverse is still so agile and still evolving you know you get there but as i said it's more visualized form and you're keeping in the center the identity of the person which can be either distributed and anonymized in some cases it can be your facebook profile identity that you're going in with your can


facebook profile identity that you're going in with your can your instagram identity that you go you know go in with so so about facebook changing so facebook has a very very interesting culture if you will look at it uh facebook is like uh its culture is that like when it thinks that it needs to do something uh and thinks that there's an existential crisis they took some they take some very very very drastic steps uh to be able to go ahead and uh and make things happen i think uh a good example was and i don't know if you remember but when google plus was launched and it was actually supposed to be the biggest project which was driven right from larry page all the way down where every aspect of google search gmail had to had a google plus button it was like the biggest you know project and it was there to kill facebook by the way because facebook was becoming very very popular and uh putting things together and uh and the story goes where mark zuckerberg actually immediately called a


goes where mark zuckerberg actually immediately called a meeting for the key you know employees of facebook and uh he basically gave the example of saying that you know back in the day rome actually destroyed a city where most of their people used to talk at the end of every sentence saying that that city must be destroyed that city must be destroyed so he made a full program where in a place like silicon valley which is also in so many ways known for its you know culture of independence and autonomy of flexibility of working uh people who are coming seven days a week to the office to make facebook at a position where it can not only become better than google plus but also kill google uh google plus which was there and they succeeded and they did succeed and not only did they survive but they thrived uh with what and how things were and of course there were some issues on the google side also because their way of monitoring the engagement was very different and like they they in one year


was very different and like they they in one year said that we have 400 active 400 million active users uh but what that meant was active users were somebody who would just click on a button anywhere in google they started thinking you know they it's like you know engagement as you would know is a very very uh tricky way because everybody tracks engagement in a very different way and uh so that was also there but the point i'm making there is that just like facebook has had that culture where the moment it sees that it has an existential threat it is ready to turn the whole company around and do whatever it takes i would say and if you saw the drop in the facebook share prices um after the last earnings call because it's the first time that facebook actually reported uh the daily active users of facebook has gone down uh i actually think it started going down long back i mean i have not logged into facebook for a very long time and most people that i know i mean they're not definitely instagram


that i know i mean they're not definitely instagram but not facebook right so uh so so if you see the trend the writing on the wall is very clear that the old way of social interaction on the internet would not remain in the future and it looks like it's a big bet that mark zuckerberg is taking and he's taken that a lot of times and succeeded so i cannot tell you whether it will be successful or not but it definitely is a very very bold bet and uh and i think it's totally worth it because when you see what you have today is no longer going to remain because the same thing that happened to facebook today will happen to instagram five years later yeah it's just the cycle of how this work what do you think is the future social media ah i don't know and anybody who says it knows is not speaking the right thing but i just think that the interactions need to start becoming more meaningful in my way my view uh i think there was a craze


my view uh i think there was a craze of being on the social media because anything new which comes in there's always this frenzy for many years oh my god there's a profile i'll be able to connect with people say hi blah blah blah but i think after that it's the froth and then you actually get to the real substance where uh making meaningful connections i think is the core of any human being so and we all know these stories right well people have thousands of facebook friends and linkedin friends but if you don't have three of them or five of them who really matter uh it's useless so i just feel that social interactions need to be out there i think we were most of our generation especially was in awe of the new way of connecting with people uh in hindsight it was a way to get to the breadth and not the depth so so i think that would that we've covered the breadth because now you have two three billion people on the on the social media uh and and